To all men in sound and troubled marriages: Please don't make the same mistakes I made!!! My wife, Rhonda, and I were married a little more than five years ago. We have one son. From the beginning of our relationship, I did not treat my wife with the respect and decency she deserved. I berated her with angry words which I sometimes screamed in her face. I tore down her self esteem and even cheated on her. While I can attribute my despicable behavior to the effects of the physical and sexual abuse I suffered as a child, I blame nobody but myself. The source of my anger and insecurity is inconsequential. I was weak and chose not to live my life as God had intended. When my infidelity became known to my wife a year into our marriage, I hit rock bottom. I was ashamed of my behavior and knew that something was wrong inside me. I pleaded with my wife for forgiveness, for her to help me heal and to allow me the chance to become the husband that she deserved. As Rhonda is a good Christian woman, she agreed to stay with me. Can you imagine that? After all the horrible things I had done to her, she was willing to stick by me! Her selfless act of love was something I had never experienced before or since. Her love was the catalyst for my healing that was to come. It changed my feelings for her from a luke-warm selfish love to a love which is so massive that I cannot describe with mere words. She also, with infinite patience, drew me closer to God and His word. In essence, she was my angel who not only saved me from my earthly, self-imposed destruction, but from eternal death by leading me to our Savior. I immediately went to counseling for my problems and we both went to a marriage counselor. Things improved somewhat. To this day I've remained faithful to her. However the road to recovery for my anger issues was a much longer one. I strived to improve myself but the anger demon was not easily slain. I failed to seek God's help for most of my recovery period. The slow, steady improvements I've made over the years were, for my marriage, too little, too late. Rhonda slipped deeper and deeper into depression mostly because of the damage I had done in the first year of our marriage. She had suppressed and buried her pain and, instead, focused on mine. Recently, Rhonda informed me that she is leaving me. I pray to Jesus that this separation will allow her to heal. As much as I'd like to believe that she will come back, I know in my heart that I am losing her forever for she has firmly declared that she no longer loves me as a wife loves her husband. When she walks out that door, she will be taking my heart with her. The extent of my suffering resulting from losing her is a million times greater than I could have ever imagined. It consumes each and every waking minute of my day. I sleep very little, and when I do, I wake up from a nightmare to a nightmare. Without the Lord's love and intervention, I do not know from where I'd draw my next breath. The prospect of life without her is void of earthly joy, peace, security, and love. My son will also be the victim of my stupidity and pompous stubbornness. I have selfishly squandered a most essential component of his happy childhood - growing up in a secure family. I have spat in the eyes of an angel, causing her pain, grief and suffering. I have destroyed that which she had dreamed of ever since she was a little girl - a happy, loving marriage. As much as I know God wants me to forgive myself, I don't know if that will ever be possible. So, if you have a wife who you take for granted... or think "what she doesn't know, won't hurt her", think again. If you have personal issues that don't allow you to treat your wife as God has commanded through His scripture, address them now! Fix them NOW! Don't think that she'll always be there despite your behavior. God was there with you when you took your vows. Your wife is His precious gift to you... your soul mate. Love and cherish her as God intended. Accept and love her for who she is... with all her human frailties. Marriage is a long-term, gradualistic process of either growing closer or growing apart, so respond to what you perceive as her "deficiencies" with love and patience so that you may grow together. Take extra care not to allow negative interactions to sneak up on you as they will compound over time. God blessed you with a brain - use it or suffer the horrific consequences from which I now suffer. Believe me, you have no idea how devastating those consequences are! Hopefully, you are reading my words before such damage has become irreversible. If so, then perhaps some good might come from the pain and anguish I'm now and will be suffering. I truly believe that God has instructed me to write this. Amazing that He can reap sweet fruit from such a poisonous vine. Lord Jesus Christ, son of almighty God, please open the minds of the men who read this so that they may avoid the senseless, infinite pain and suffering that will result from not treating their wives as You have commanded. Help them realize how precious their wives are despite their human frailties. Give them the ability to feel, through my words, the depth and enormity of my pain so that they can be motivated to seek out Your path. Help them realize the true beauty and depth of their love for their wives while they still have the opportunity to apply that love to their actions. Bless them and their marriages so that they may serve You and Your purpose for our lives. Thank you, dear Lord, for holding me together in my time of darkness. Please forgive me for destroying my marriage. In the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, I pray. Amen.

9/29/2008 3:21:22 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

I'm sorry for the three of you...never give up, if they go, don't give in, stand on the promises He made, find scriptures that speak to you, claim them, speak them out loud, give them life, be faithful to her, no matter how long it takes let your wife and son see the man He created you to be, some times you must let something go, then it can return,remember the prodical son, he left, he broke his fathers heart, he only saw the good times, felt the love, missed it longed for it, then his son came home, i know this is different yet thats what i keep thinking, you need to hold it together for you son, he needs a father, you can still be the best dad on earth, Lord you know whats needed here, i ask that Your hand be on this, that Your will be done, that Your mend broken hearts, matthew 6:33-34.....psalm 46:10a. 1 corinthians13:7 God bless, protect.

9/29/2008 5:17:57 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Wow DanD, all your suffering and the tragedy of so many broken marriages are sobering reminders of why we need Jesus today and His Kingdom to come! I hope I'm one of the guys in a sound marriage to whom you were speaking; I think I got the point. Thanks for so candidly sharing your heartache in order to help! My mindset has always been: that could never happen to our marriage. However, with so much experience being wrong throughout my life, I realize I should seriously reflect on this issue. In the history of famous last words there has been a continuous line of men who regret taking the love of their wives for granted. After reading your words yesterday afternoon, I went home with a vague sense of needing to do better. Soon I was trading my own, slightly impractical agenda for my wife's totally frivolous designs, as we headed for the open road. Sure, my daughter's homework didn't get done (and she was crying about that this morning) and we all went to sleep much too late (again) - but, what fun for the whole family! Fleeting thoughts of how my kids will ever learn to navigate the real world when they have both parents stuck in the clouds, often worry me. However, I think it is imperative that children see their parents in love and enjoying marriage. We're all praying that your marriage will become a love story with the happy twist of plot that only God can write. God is love (1 John 4:16) and therefore we can be sure love is more powerful than anything seeking to destroy it. Being in God's hands, He will be working on both of you. Your love for your wife, which you now express so beautifully, is a powerful encouragement for other husbands and most particularly to your son. Whether you and your wife reunite or take separate paths, your son would be fortunate to grow up, from this point on, with your testimony of love for his mother always in view. Thank you for taking the time to communicate a vital message. Sometimes the marriage you are blessing may not be your own; I hope you receive some comfort in knowing your sad words may produce joy in those that listen.

9/30/2008 9:44:56 AM by Ryan, Member of Delve into Jesus since 12/30/2007

Ryan, Thank you SO MUCH for taking the time to give me evidence that God is using my failures to help others avoid the same! This gives me comfort in a time of despair. I pray that our Lord will spread my testimony far and wide so as many men as possible will wake up and do their part to protect and enrich their marriages. I also pray that the wives who see problems growing in their marriages will take my words to their husbands so that they can both reflect on their marriages' paths. It is in our nature to ask Him why bad things sometimes happen to his children. Perhaps part of His plan for me and my family to walk through this dark valley was so others may avoid such a horrible outcome. I continue to try to put this all in His hands and am humbled and joyous to be the vessel of his work. However, as hard as I may try to be patient to see what He plans to do with my marriage, my grief implores me to seek the answer. It's hard not to pray to him to just mercifully take me home. Please pray that He protects my children and my wife from the pain of these events, and that He gives me strength to make it through another day. Thanks, again, Ryan - not only for sharing this with me (us), but for considering the importance of your own marriage and for changing your plans last night for the benefit of your marriage. Please consider reserving one evening, Saturday, etc., each week (or even every other week) to do something with just your wife. Even if it is to simply bring her a flower with a love note attached - it will show her that she is loved and adored. Most importantly, pray regularly to our Lord Jesus Christ that he keeps you on His path so that your marriage will maintain His blessings. Dan

9/30/2008 1:01:37 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, Thank you for sharing your pain and words of wisdom. I'd like to suggest you forgive yourself as well as your wife. It was satan who comes only to kill, steal and destroy that caused your problems. I know you have confessed your sin to the Father and He has forgiven you. You are a blessed brother. God is restoring marriages daily. Your marriage will be restored too. He has never left you and you are not forsaken. Do the work of the Lord and know that all is well. Just believe.

9/30/2008 7:24:31 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Hey Dan - I like your advice and will take it to heart! You brought out a few points on which I'd like to improve my performance. When I read your mention of love notes, I laughed because I am a champion love letter writer - or used to be, at least. I really think I've given my wife close to 1000 love letters over the years (I have a method for calculating that number). All were written on original design cards I made, no two alike and many made from some of her favorite items found in nature, which I had collected. One memorable fête was 50 white origami birds arranged in clusters at varying heights. Before I folded each sheet of paper, in the corner which would become the head of the bird, I used a red felt calligraphy pen to write a short note on some, and Bible verses on others. My largest achievement, at nearly two stories tall, was a paper sculpture/love note suspended from three light fixtures. Unfortunately, in the sport of love letter writing there is no resting on your laurels. My wife, who may typify many wives, goes on the notion of not having received a love note today means she has not received a love note in almost forever. They have an insatiable need to hear "I love you!" Not that there is anything wrong with that, once you catch on to it all but, they sure are different from us! I'm guessing I tune out many of the times she tells me she loves me - just because I know that. You also reminded me of another thing which I haven't done in several weeks - but will do tomorrow. I used to visit a Spanish language site I found on Gospel.com and print out Devotionals for her to read in her language. I would leave one per day somewhere in the house in a place which might surprise or cause her to hunt for hidden ones. I know your wife is very sensitive now and may need a lot of space. It must be a very delicate balance; trying to communicate with her in a way that signifies you respect her need for healing but also desire to share some tender words which you hope wont be construed as just cheap sweet talk. I'm wondering, since you are fantastic at expressing your love for her, if it would be appropriate to leave a few short but sweet notes for her - maybe with some of her favorite Bible verses on them (but having nothing to do with staying together)? What about leaving a devotional per day for her with just one hand written line form you on the top (provided the material is free from any stand by your man at any cost sentiments)? I'm not good at giving advice and I'm sure you know better what is appropriate in your situation (the above just fits nicely within my marriage). True love is a wonderful motivator. I believe, through God's help, you can receive the inspiration to do some amazing things that work in your circumstances. You've been blessed with talents which God may desire to work through. I'm in agreement with Mrs. Piggy, regarding Satan's plan to destroy marriages. We each have to work on our marriages - while standing on God's promises.

9/30/2008 8:33:00 PM by Ryan, Member of Delve into Jesus since 12/30/2007

Mrs. Piggy, thanks for your insight. Self forgiveness is very hard for me as those who were sexually abused as children feel very bad about themselves, and hence the self-destructive behavior in adult life. Having to face up now to the results of the pain I caused my wife four years ago really makes it even more difficult. It's like I've just lost all the progess I made since I "crashed" back then. Rhonda, to justify her decision to leave me, continues to point out how terrible I treated her. This makes self forgiveness even harder. And then finally, I know I must be accept responsibility for my actions, regardless of my childhood horrors. Self forgiveness conflicts with accepting one's own responsibility. While I've been able to answer many questions about myself and my situation, I cannot understand why God would have let me be subjected to both physical and sexual abuse as a child. Beatings started as far back as I can remember and the sexual abuse happened to me when I was 5 and 6. It has destroyed my life and, ironically, at a point where I have healed the most, the most precious thing to me is being taken away. I really changed which allowed me to avoid confrontations with Rhonda. Most of the time over the past 1 1/2 years, I was the one who was the calming force in the relationship. By the way, she is preparing to sign a one year lease and has now withdrawn her offer to go to a marriage enrichment retreat with me. I feel so hopeless for I know I'm losing her forever. God, please give me the strength to carry on.

9/30/2008 10:57:00 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Ryan, thanks for replying. You are the King of love letters! Ever since Rhonda informed me of her intention to leave me (last Thursday), she rejects any and all "positive" comments and actions on my part. So I'm just trying to stay out of her way. It looks like she'll be gone by October 15. That will be one of the hardest days of my life.

9/30/2008 11:17:19 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Dan - I feel so badly for all you've been through and are experiencing now. I will be praying for you and your family daily. I apologize for writing about celebrating love when others are going through such dreadful trials. I do want you to know your comments really did motivate me to refresh some aspects of my marriage - for this I am grateful. If we accept the sacrifice Jesus gave to remove our sins do we have the right to hold on to refusal to forgive ourselves? I agree we have to take responsibility for our actions but, Jesus wants us to live in the knowledge that we are forgiven. I'm sure that the answers to all questions (like why abuse/suffering?) are to be found in a growing relationship with Him. Jesus died to forgive you; He lives to heal you - we want to support the work He is doing in you by praying for His will in your life.

10/1/2008 8:15:38 AM by Ryan, Member of Delve into Jesus since 12/30/2007

Ryan, No need to apologize... quite the contrary. Reading about the wonderful way you treat your wife and sensing the bond you two have is uplifting for me. I hope other husbands read your words as well so that they can take from your example. The one and only counseling session Rhonda has consented to attend with me is at noon today. She is treating it like an exit interview at a job... addressing parameters of the separation. I starting to believe that all the talk about "clearing her head" and "healing" so that she could see if there is any chance of a future together is just bunk - designed to give me false hope so that I won't try to talk her out of leaving. When I put myself in her shoes, her reasons for leaving and "no longer loving me" don't add up. We had 1 1/2 years of horror followed by 4 years of healing and growing closeness. Her love should have died way back then, not after years of my hard work, love and pure committment. I pray that Jesus walks with me today. Thanks, Ryan.

10/1/2008 9:07:24 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, I am going to assume that you became a born-again believer after you were abused as a child and after you abused your wife. Given this scenerio, all that occurred before salvation has been covered by the blood of Jesus. And any wrong doing since; provided you confess your sin to God, He is just and will forgive you and cleanse you. God cannot go against His word. His word clearly states, forgive and you shall be forgiven. It does not matter if it is hard, you MUST forgive yourself. If the all-knowing Holy Creator of the universe can forgive you, who are you not to forgive yourself? Inasmuch as your wife continues to remind you of your past mistakes indicates that she has not forgiven you. The same command was issued to her if she is a believer. She must forgive you so that she can be forgiven. And she must forgive herself. Our Lord, Jesus Christ died so that we could all be forgiven. For His sake, we must forgive so that His dying was not in vain. Do not let the enemy hold you in bondage like this. Whom the Son sets free, is free indeed. Forgiveness is freedom. I, myself spent many years in this type of bondage. My greatest joy came in the revelation of self-forgiveness. The Father wishes to do a great work through you. He needs you to forgive yourself in order to do it. Where would we be if Paul didn't forgive himself for killing all those Christians before he, himself was called by God? That's why he penned the words, "Forgetting those things which are behind me" in Phillipians 3:13. When we forgive, we line up with God's Word and our healing is manifested right away. When we line up with His Word, we are delighting ourselves in Him and He gives us the desires of our hearts. Enter His gates with thanksgiving and His courts with praise. Ask Him to help you forgive yourself. It's a good thing and He has promise to not withhold any good thing from us. I will be standing in prayer that the Holy Spirit will guide you into self-forgiveness. God hates divorce, so I hate divorce. God loves you, so I love you. I pray all the promises of God for your life in the name of Jesus.

10/1/2008 9:13:35 AM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Mrs. Piggy, Thanks for helping me to focus on the issue of self-forgiveness. Everything you say makes sense - I know God wants me to forgive myself. I pray that He fortifies me so that I can accomplish that goal. It would be great to simply say, "yes, I'll now forgive myself" but that would be dishonest and would not prove a thing. Maybe after all my efforts to save my marriage have failed, it will be possible to forgive myself. For now, the need to hold myself accountable seems to make it impossible to forgive myself... but I'll keep trying for I know you are right. I read your last response to Rhonda - specifically, the part about her not forgiving me. She affirms that she has forgiven me, but used this analogy: If you cut off my leg and then, later, are remorseful and asked for my forgiveness... and I did, indeed, forgive you, I still would be without a leg. The "leg" in this case, is her love for me. I'd really be interested in your response to that. Thank you (and everyone who has reached out to me) for your love, support, and advice. DIJ is like a lifeline to me now. You have no idea how much everyone's support is helping me get through this!!! Thank you, Heavenly Father, for guiding me to this sanctuary!!! And thanks to those who established, support, and operate it!!!

10/1/2008 12:13:13 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

"Maybe after all my efforts to save my marriage have failed, it will be possible to forgive myself" Brother Dan, I do not like the words you have written above. The go against the Word of God. His Word says we are victorious in all circumstances. We are hid in Christ. He does not fail ever. So, we don't fail either. No, you can't save your marriage, you can't do anything without total faith in God. With God, all things are possible. As for your wife's analogy, I once used a simular one when I refused to forgive my husband. My husband said he didn't intend to hurt me. I responded, If you accidently run over a small child, you didn't intend to either, but the child is still dead. The Holy Spirit convicted me and let me know that I was in rebellion. Forgiveness is a commandment, not an option. When you forgive a person, you "give" them the love you gave be"for"e the incident occurred. Love and forgiveness are not feelings in the begining, they are actions that are made by decision. Try this on: "But God demonstrated (action) His own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us." Romans 5:8 Jesus said we are to love one another. We say we love God, but we demonstrate that love when we obey His word. God loved us so much, He sent Jesus to die for us so that we could be forgiven. Forgiveness is a very big deal in God's eyes. How can you love your neighbor as yourself, when you don't love yourself enough to forgive yourself? Please know that I say this in love: Anytime we do not do as the Word of God instructs, we are in rebellion. Not forgiving ourselves and one another violates the work Jesus established at the cross. I understand your wife is deeply hurt. But, that does not absolve her or you from following God's word. How many times should I forgive my brother, Lord. Every time. Take the focus off yourself and put it on Christ. It is He Who does the work, not you. Did He not say, cast your cares on Him? Please do me a favor and pray for my husband. What you pray for my husband, God will cause it to happen for you. Did He not say, "give and it shall be given unto you? I would like to recomend a book for your wife entitled, Love Matters. It is by Dennis Leonard. It will change her life. You should read it too.

10/1/2008 1:44:50 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Mrs. Piggy, After I posted my response to your message in which I said, ""Maybe after all my efforts to save my marriage have failed, it will be possible to forgive myself" I continued to ponder your point. While driving to what I thought was going to be our one and only counseling session (more on that in a bit), I knew you were right. So, as part of my prayer to God asking that He bless the session, I acknowledged to Him that my failure to forgive myself was against His will. While I still acknowledge my responsibility for my terrible acts of the past, I know in my heart that my actions (remorse, efforts to change, success in changing, etc.) over the past 4 years prove I truly, truly have repented for those sins against Him and my wife. I acknowledge that I had no control over my childhood abuses and that my resulting dysfunctions were understandable. Had I done nothing to end my dysfunctions, then I would have not been repentant - God would not have forgiven me so I could not have done so either. But I did sincerely repent and He DID forgive me. So, through my repentance to Him I have also repented to myself. I then forgave myself of that which He had already forgiven me. Thank you SO MUCH for helping me find a path to self-forgiveness! I know this had to be done in order to walk on His path instead of mine. He has done great work through you! The counseling session when well. Rhonda is still separating from me but she said she is still willing to work on our relationship by going to church with me and by attending another session next week. She said she will keep an open mind to the possibility that she may still have a wife's love for me somewhere inside her, but that, if it exists, it is buried under her emotions of anger, pain, and distrust. I truly want her to heal and be happy again - even if that means that it be without me in her life. I'm sure my feelings for her are "love" and not merely "need" masquerading as love. So, as much as it scares me and as much as I'll miss having her close to me, I committed myself to support her decision. Perhaps she will see this as the true act of my love that it is. If she ever can ever love me as her husband again, the proof of my love will be essential. I still fear that, if she heals away from me, that she will never believe she can be happy with me. It's kind of like putting your hand over a lit burner - once you get burned, you don't want to put your hand there again, even if the burner has been shut off. I just hope she doesn't change her mind later and shut the door on me forever. It all truly is in the hands of our Lord Jesus. I will continue to pray to Him that we will avoid a divorce. If it is His will that our marriage is saved, then I'll rejoice loud enough for all to hear. If, however, it is His will that we divorce, I will keep reading the book of Job and stay determined to keep my faith intact and strong, knowing that the reasons for His plan will someday be revealed to me. Dear Lord Jesus, thank you for seeing me through another day... for sending me your messenger to guide me to my own forgiveness... for your intervention in today's counseling session, and for helping me see the path You have chosen for me. Please reassure me if I become weak, comfort me in the lonely months to come where I will surely miss my wife's presence with me. Protect her and remove from her heart the pain and suffering I caused. Guide her decisions so that, if it be Your will, she will return to me and allow me to love, cherish, and honor her according to Your plan until You call us both home. In Christ's name I pray, Amen.

10/1/2008 3:47:58 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, Divorce is never God's will. God said, "For I hate divorce!" Malachi 2:16 If you and your wife are willing, your marriage can not only heal, but flourish! Do the work of believing God and you will see that He will not withhold this good thing from you. Praise Him always. He is working all things together for your good. There's a new movie that came out last week called Fireproof, concerning how God heals marriages that appear to be headed for divorce. I am going to see it tomorrow. I was going today, but an appointment popped up that I can't miss. Do you think you could take your wife to see it as a date? If she consents, please buy her popcorn and a drink. I think married couples should continue to date each other until death. I love movies. My husband does not. But he takes me and manages to stay awake. He used to go to sleep before we were married, even if seeing the movie was his idea. :)

10/1/2008 4:24:47 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Mrs. Piggy, When I remind Rhonda that God hates divorce, she responds with reference to Matthew 19:9 Jesus said, "Moses provided for divorce as a concession to your hard heartedness, but it is not part of God's original plan. I'm holding you to the original plan, and holding you liable for adultery if you divorce your faithful wife and then marry someone else. I make an exception in cases where the spouse has committed adultery." I don't want to start a battle of scripture with her but I think that God truly hates divorce - even when infidelity is a factor so long as the sinning spouse is truly repentant and has proved that he/she can now be trusted. If a spouse continued to cheat time and time again, then I would think that God would, indeed embrace the option of divorce. Rhonda knows in her heart that I've remained faithful to her ever since I "crashed" more than four years ago. More importantly, I think she knows I would never betray her again. The mere thought of being unfaithful to her again sickens me. Even if she divorces me, I intend to stay faithful to her thereafter. She is my wife and a piece of paper from the State will never change that. THANK YOU for telling me about the movie Fireproof!!!!! I just watched the trailer and all I can say is WOW! For me and Rhonda, the timing of this movie's release is another of God's wonderful, bold miracles. Now my challenge is to see if she will watch it with me.

10/1/2008 5:12:22 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Dan - We have a lot to thank God for today! Your last update was exciting to read; I'm delighted you have found the path toward forgiving your self and that you know that this is the path Jesus wants you on! I am glad your wife is willing to attend church and further counseling with you. There is also much hope in her statement regarding keeping an open mind about her love for you. As we continue praying for you, we will be expecting more good news!

10/1/2008 5:14:53 PM by Ryan, Member of Delve into Jesus since 12/30/2007

Our God is faithful His word is true, i have been reading all you have said and all the responses, let me tell you, i am blessed, i'm even happy for you, you are going through, i love that word, when it's used in the bible, psalm 23 says through the darkest valley, through the fire, they walked through the red sea, now that's not natural, so they did it in faith & trust, they made it to the other side, i don't think they liked being there,the fire brings out the purest of gold, your a winner, go for GOLD. God bless you and your family, i will send you a card for your GOLDEN wedding ann, see it believe it then you will have it

10/1/2008 5:54:44 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

One more thing for me to thank God for!!! Rhonda has agreed to go see Fireproof with me tomorrow. At first, she started to make excuses (my son's flag football practice) so I told her I would take time off work for a matinée. After reading the reviews, I am even more convinced that the timing of this movie's release (the day after she told me she intends to leave me) is God's bold, unmistakable miracle for me. I'll keep my feet on the ground, though. Her heart is pretty hard to me now and I do acknowledge that she needs to heal. I'll give you my review of the movie (and how Rhonda responds to it) tomorrow. Thanks, again, mrspiggy!!!!!!!!!!!

10/1/2008 6:10:09 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Great!! I'll be seeing it tomorrow afternoon also. Don't forget to treat her like it's a date, not an appointment. God bless. I'm glad that you see the movie as God's miracle for you. That's the attitude you should have. I was laid off my job and exhausted my unemployment benefits. When I applied for an extension, I was told I couldn't get one because the state was not giving extensions. I boldly told the lady who was handling my case, "You don't know the God I serve. He will change the law if need be." Two weeks later, the president, Bush, signed the state's petition to extend the benefits. Now, that's favor!! Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things will be added. Favor is an added thing.

10/1/2008 7:25:57 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

What a blessing to read all these posts! God is soooooo good! Here is a song to remember as you face the days ahead: GOD IS SO GOOD Give thanks to the Lord, for He is good. 1 Chronicles 16:34 God is so good, God is so good, God is so good, Hes so good to me! He cares for me, He cares for me, He cares for me, Hes so good to me! I love Him so, I love Him so, I love Him so, Hes so good to me! I praise His Name, I praise His Name, I praise His Name, Hes so good to me! (Dan, your faith is blossoming! No matter how dark the past was, the future with Jesus is BRIGHT!) "He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake." Psalm 23:3 (Lifting you and your Family in prayer.)

10/2/2008 8:09:59 AM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

Why am I not surprised? This morning before I left for work, Rhonda agreed for me to pick her up at 12:15 pm to go see Fireproof. Less than two hours later, she called me at my office and said she "has too much to do like get her paperwork filled out for the house she intends to lease" (one year lease). "We can go see it tomorrow", she said. Well, as she is heading out of town late tomorrow afternoon for a weekend family event, I anticipate that she'll cancel again tomorrow morning. OK, before you all start shouting at me ;-) to keep the faith, I'll do my best to do so. Maybe God is giving me another lesson in trusting Him, but this roller coaster ride is really taking its toll on me. For the first time since she dropped the bomb on me, I actually slept a little better last night because I had this miracle for a pillow. Now I'm back to shaking inside. I guess I should look on the bright side - over the past week, I've lost 10 of the 15 lbs I wanted to lose. ;-) Lord Jesus, it's all in your hands.

10/2/2008 10:33:30 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

That's satan's plan, having you shaking on the inside......read Jeremiah 29:11, that's Gods plan......you keep looking on bright side, thats where He is. God bless

10/2/2008 4:48:03 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

I saw the movie. I went alone cause my hubby is at work and all my married girlfriends are working too. It is well worth the time (2 hours) and seven dollars spent (matinee). I would recommend this movie to any couple. I am also planning to buy the book, "The Love Dare" by Stephen and Alex Kendrick. The movie centers around it. That's all I will say for now. I would like to discuss it after everyone else has seen it. Please don't make me wait too long. I think Day one was "Love is patient". Many blessings to all.

10/2/2008 5:13:11 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Brother Dan, I am in agreement with you concerning this movie being for you. Here's my reason. Yesterday, I wrote a scripture in response to your wife's analogy; Romans 5:8. Today, at the end of the movie, I stood up to leave and as I took the first step, Romans 5:8 appeared on the movie screen. Of course, I stumbled, then shouted. Yes, I believe that God is in agreement with your marriage being healed. I believe that Rhonda will have a change of heart when she sees this movie. You might want to consider buying the "Love Dare" book, too. Just from the few pages I read online, I believe that every marriage could benefit from a copy. Even the strong, sound ones. Real, true love is a lifetime achievement. You can never learn too much about it.

10/2/2008 5:30:41 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Yesterday afternoon in my office, my mind was focused (as much as it can these days) on my work. Out of the blue, I received an unmistakable message from Jesus. I'll not give the details because I don't want anyone to think I've become "hyper-faithful", but I will say it was so profound that my faith will never be the same. Within minutes of this the phone rang - it was Rhonda. She was completely out of control, yelling about a small infraction between my oldest daughter and my son. She also told me she was not going to see Fireproof with me today. The timing of Jesus' message to me was not arbitrary. Instead of reacting with my own emotion and pain, I very calmly and lovingly responded to Rhonda that everything would be OK... that I would come home and deal with the children. She was still on fire, it appeared that nothing would calm her. As I went home, I prayed that He would guide my words and my demeanor. When I got there, I settled the minor issue with the kids. Rhonda continued to rant with anger... her face contorted with spite and hatred. "I DON'T HAVE TIME TO GO TO THAT MOVIE TOMORROW!!! YOU ARE PUSHING ME!!! With the calm He had given me, I softly told her that I wasn't pushing her, that I was merely asking for two hours of her time. I told her that I'd gladly give her four hours of my own time to make up for it so that she could see the movie with me as well as finish her tasks. I then showed her the video (not the movie trailer which she had already seen) that describes why they made the movie. While she was still "fired up", she shocked me with, "OK, I'll go, but it won't change my mind!!! If I lose this house because I don't get the lease paperwork in tomorrow, it will be your fault!!! I'm only going because if I don't, you'll never let me hear the end of it!!!" She said some other things of which I won't repeat! ;-) I'm certain I would have never handled the situation in that manner if He hadn't sent His unmistakable, strong message to me minutes before the incident. I'm also certain that it was Jesus who got her to agree to go to the movie even though she was still fuming with anger. I know my wife - when angry, she redefines stubborn! I believe His strong actions are the result of me finally forgiving myself (THANKS, MRSPIGGY!!!!). I now am filled with peace and calm. I slept like a baby last night. The churning lump in my stomach is gone. I am gleefully happy because I have never been so close to God in my entire life. I truly see that the blessing of such a close relationship to Him is infinitely more important than any earthly relationship. From my relationship with Him, I am confident that whatever He has planned for me here, it will be what I need. As it relates to whether or not Rhonda leaves me or not, I strangely have no concern about the outcome of Rhonda seeing the movie. Yes, I'd rejoice like a crazy man if she reversed her decision, but I think I'll rejoice if her plans remains unchanged. For I know He is in control of this situation. I'm now riding in the back seat and He is driving. How could I be concerned about where He is taking me? He knows that at the top of my heart's desires is for my marriage to be saved. He has boldly made his presence known to me. I'm happy to walk down whatever path he has for me, regardless of how rough it is. It is my privilege to respect and serve Him. One hour to go before the movie. I'll let you all know how it goes. Thank you all so much for sticking with me through this. Rejoice in knowing that He is working through you all. You have thus far been a big part of His miracle for me. Heavenly Father, thank You for coming into my life even though I've not always opened my door to You. Thank You for answering my prayers for a lifeline by sending me to this sanctuary of Your faithful. Thank You for using this terrible incident in my life to bring me to my knees so that I could see that You are my Savior, my light, and my provider of all things. Thank You for combating my pig-headedness by sending me such an irrefutable sign of your presence. Please heal Rhonda's heart for it is now hard and cold. Please give her peace and love so that she may calm herself into a clear mind. Help her to forgive me and herself so that her heart can be purged of the anger and spite it now contains. Help her heal from the effects of my past transgressions. Please help her find Your path for her. And if Your path is for her to separate from me, please protect her, keep her safe, and let her see over time that my love for her is pure, sincere, endless, and of your inspiration. Lead her back to me, dear Jesus. I love her beyond all imaginable limits, for she is my soul mate. In the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, I pray. Amen.

10/3/2008 12:48:49 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Praise God!! I am so happy that you see God in your situation. It is wonderful to see His Face. Please promise me that you will see the movie, even if you see it alone. It will be worth it. Keeping you in my prayers.

10/3/2008 2:56:10 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Thank You Jesus! Dan you prayers are beautiful! When God comes into your life, it can't stay the same!

10/3/2008 11:13:50 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

We saw Fireproof together What a wonderful, powerful message from God for all marriages! I cannot say enough good about the movie and the concept of "the Love Dare". Beyond the perfectly stated message it sends about God's intention for us with respect to the permanence of marriage, it was very entertaining. Hollywood should take lessons from Sherwood!!!! (uh.. Sherwood Pictures, that is). Rhonda sat through the movie without expressing any emotion. I know that must have been hard for her as there were so many precise similarities between the movie and our story. At those points where I particularly connected, I'll admit I could not choke back the tears... tears which I tried to hide from her as I didn't want her to think I was trying to pressure her. As I watched, I prayed that He would open her heart to the many applicable points in the movie. By the way, I sure wish I would have had a father like the one in the movie. My life would have been very different if I had. I will make sure my son never has to make that statement. Her only post-viewing comment was that "their situation didn't include infidelity" - as if that negated the movie's many messages. But I know she was touched far beyond her outward expressions... she was quiet, immediately hid behind her sunglasses and... well, I know my wife. She later said that she is open to "dating" me after she moves out and gets settled. But again, I know my wife. She is single-focused on her "new life" without me. She will never be "settled". I know that if she moves out, I'll have lost her forever. However, I will keep an open mind as this whole situation is solely in His hands. One thing that my recent self forgiveness and this movie opened my mind to was that Rhonda has some responsibility in our marital problems. While the husband in the movie was on Day 43 of the 40 day dare when his wife finally opened her heart to him, I'm now on roughly Day 550 (really). I've taken the "high road" for about that long, employing many of the strategies depicted in the movie. When she yells at me, I don't respond with anger but with calm reassurance. I've tried to accommodate her needs, her schedule, her preferences and to help her with her simple day-to-day tasks. I've tried to show her affection which she soundly rejects. I've not let a single day go by that I didn't tell her that I love her. I'm told by those around me that I kiss her derrière to the max. But she has continued to reject and despise me. While I'll never downplay my responsibility for the damage I caused to our marriage years ago, I believe Rhonda has inadvertently used my past to hold over my head... it gives her power over me... allows her to continuously be the victim. This has worn me down - Day 550 and still no positive response. Being told, day after day after day, how terrible I was and seeming to never be good enough for her has taken its toll on my self esteem and my confidence. But through this experience and with His intervention, His forgiveness, and my own self forgiveness, that will now end. I believe He wanted me to see Fireproof with her so that her response would allow me to see His path for us. I'm now convinced that His path is for Rhonda to leave. As it is, we are not functional as husband and wife nor is our marriage even close to that which God intended according to His scripture. If 550 days of me employing "love dare" tactics didn't heal our relationship, I do not believe that the separation will change anything either. I will keep an open mind because I know God hates divorce. He is the only one who can change the terminal course of our marriage. But I have come to accept that "it is all over but the paperwork". With acceptance comes peace. God has granted me that peace and I thank Him for that blessing. Lord Jesus Christ, son of almighty God, thank you for seeing me through this dark time... for being merciful by using only 11 days to lead me out of that darkness... for the peace you've provided for my heart. Most importantly, thank you for not giving up on me when my faith in You was all but gone. You have used this dark cloud to provide me with the most wonderful silver lining - the resurrection of my faith. You were bold when You hit me over the head with Your clear, undeniable sign of Your presence. That is a gift few receive, but You knew what I needed and You provided it for me. I am now joyous to follow Your path which I will always seek hereafter. Please bless Rhonda with your guidance and protection... help her find peace, healing, and the power to forgive as she pursues her new life on her own. Help my son to adjust to this situation. Give him security and confidence that he will be OK even though his parents are no longer together. Help me handle all of the new responsibilities I will now have to assume so that they do not detract from my time and focus my children need from me. In Jesus' name I pray, Amen.

10/5/2008 12:28:43 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, I am filled with joy to read your post. Do not let Rhonda's reaction affect you. As a wife, I too, have been in her position. Not the infidelity, but the holding stuff over his head. For our first anniversary, I wanted us to go away for a long weekend trip. We'd discussed it and made plans, but his son decided to come to town the same weekend and our plans were cancelled. I was deeply hurt. For weeks I pouted. One morning, my husband asked me, "What can I do to put a smile on your face?" I responded very negatively to him. I screamed at him that you only have a first anniversary once and there was nothing he could do to fix things, he'd chosen his son over me. Then, no matter what he did, I wasn't happy with it. Months pasted before I forgave him. I cannot begin to tell you how many terrible things happened to me in that time span. I came to realize how important it is to forgive right away. Unforgiveness is dangerous. I have endeavored to pass the lesson on to others. I know you love her, so give her space and time. She needs time with Jesus. He will be sending people who will speak into her life. Their words will confirm what she saw in the movie. I declare and decree that she will return to you with a contrite heart and a forgiving spirit. You keep your focus on your walk with God. Keep praying, believing and praising Him. Tell others how great He is. While you're taking care of His business, He'll be taking care of yours.

10/5/2008 1:49:34 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Thank you all! I know I've thanked you all before, but, because I feel I've reached a point of victory, I wanted to say "THANK YOU" all for the wonderful support, advice and spiritual guidance. May God bless you for your service to Him and for what you all did to help me through this. I hope he holds a special place in His Kingdom for each of you.

10/5/2008 2:31:13 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

I thank God and praise His Holy Name for all He is doing in your life! Mind if I share something? In our home we have a tall wooden plaque. It is on "Love." The plaque reads: "Love is patient and kind. Love does not envy or boast. It is not rude or self-seeking. It is not easily angered. IT KEEPS NO RECORD OF WRONGS. Love does not delight in evil. Love rejoices in truth. It always protects always trusts. Always hopes always endures. Love never fails." (All CAPS mine!) (See 1 Corinthians 13:4-8a) I remember one night, I had thoughts about something from my Husbands past... I became angry. He climbed into bed, and I ignored him. I kept creeping closer and closer to my side of the bed... Then a verse came to my mind. "BE ANGRY, AND yet DO NOT SIN; do not let the sun go down on your anger," Ephesians 4:26 I was stuborn. I kept chewing on it. I grew more and more angrier at my Husband. (I never told him I was even mad. He had no idea I was angry about something that happened many years ago...) Before I knew it, I rolled over so far, I had to catch myself from falling off the bed! Suddenly, a verse came to my mind. "Be not hasty in thy spirit to be angry: for anger resteth in the bosom of fools." Ecclesiastes 7:9 Suddenly, I GOT IT! I forgave him, and have not been tormented by those thoughts again!

10/5/2008 3:31:08 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

FAITH, TRUST, HOPE....Never loose sight of His promises, no matter what, not even sure if this is in the bible, but this keeps coming to me having done all else STAND, in time your wife will thank you, i pray the veil to be removed, His will to be done, He answers prayer, gives us the desires of our heart, hates devorce, so stand, it's worth it, for both of you. God may Your peace fill my brother now, may Your love wash over him, we thank You that You love us want the very best for us, we trust You we thank You now for the restoration. Once the prodical left he found he was better off at home, he only found that out by leaving, the father loved him enough to let him go. God bless you..... BOTH

10/5/2008 7:17:06 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Having done all else stand, in FAITH, TRUST, HOPE, IN TIME YOUR WIFE WILL THANK YOU, He answers prayer, hates devorce, gives us the desires of our hearts, thats all i need, now it's all in His PERFECT timing, you said she will leave, you know the story of the prodical son, well the father loved him enough to let him go, the son found the world on his own, wasn't what he thought, you know the rest, Lord i pray, the veil be removed, i pray ears to opened, You will to be done in the name of Jesus. God bless you .....BOTH

10/5/2008 7:30:52 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Sorry, my computer spat the dummy i didn't think my reply sent, so i did another, come back and both were on the screen.

10/5/2008 7:42:42 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Ephesians 6:13 Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand." Notice it reads "when the day of evil comes" not, if. This lets us know the day of evil IS coming to all of us, but we must study God's Word until it is first nature to us. How do we stand? "Stand firm then, with the belt of truth around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place (which is why we must constantly practice forgiveness) and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace. In addition to all this, take up the shield of Faith, with which you can extinquish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the Word of God." The belt of truth (who you are in Christ). The breastplate of righteousness (when we confess our sins to Him, He forgives us and restores us to righteousness). The gospel of peace (the peace He left for us. For He is the prince of peace. He paid the price to put us again at peace with God). "Now Faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see." Hebrews 11:1 I believe that God will restore your marriage and it will be wonderful. I have all faith that this will be so. I have prayed the fervent (heart-felt), effectual (lines up with God's Word) prayer, and it will avail. Amen.

10/5/2008 8:10:40 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Rhonda keeps telling me that she has forgiven me and then refers to the analogy I previously referenced: If you cut off my leg and then, later, are remorseful and asked for my forgiveness... and I did, indeed, forgive you, I still would be without a leg. The "leg" in this case, is her love for me. I tried to explain to her that love doesn't work that way, but she just gave me a dirty look and walked away. I know that she won't be able to heal inside if she refuses to acknowledge that merely saying she forgives me means nothing in sight of the fact that her actions prove otherwise. Could she really just stop loving me? Just as in Fireproof, I don't believe she has had "good" counsel on this - her friends are sure to feed her desire to move out. Her healing is my main concern here. With or without me in her future, I don't want the legacy of my past mistakes to continue to harm her. I pointed her to Romans 5:8 and 2 Corinthians 2:7. They didn't phase her. I shared with her the experiences you Christian wives have described here. She continues to point to the fact that infidelity was not a component in your examples. Then she references Matthew 19:9. Anybody have any suggestions? Again, I just don't want her to carry the past around with her any longer. It will inhibit her ability to heal her heart and her soul.

10/5/2008 10:54:07 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, I'm going to go out on a limb and ask you this: Is Rhonda saved? When I was unforgiving of my husband, I could literally hear God say to me, "I forgave you". Does she not realize her soul is at stake? In His eyes, every sin is equal. Her holding unforgiveness is the same as your infidelity. Sin is sin. Rhonda should read Matthew 18:21-35. If she does not forgive you, God will not forgive her. When we walk in unforgiveness, we can't get a prayer through. He only hears the prayers of the righteous. And we can only be righteous when we confess our sin and receive His forgiveness. So, it's not an option. She has to forgive you totally from her heart to receive forgiveness from the Father. Remember the Lord's prayer. "Forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us." As children of the Most High, we are to let our faith lead our emotions, not the other way around. I understand she is hurt, but her pain is not an acceptable reason to sin. I'm sure Jesus was in pain when he was beaten and had His beard pulled out. But He didn't rebell and refuse to go to the cross. Thank God.

10/5/2008 11:27:24 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

I gotta chime in here...as I've been following this for a bit. DanD, Your faith and trust in God are astounding. Whenever someone is in such an extremely tough situation as yourself, it always makes me wonder what I would do if I were put in that same situation. We'd all like to say we would remain faithful to God, but it's a whole different thing when it's real and more so when it's your own life. I'm not even married (or even close) and I am inspired by your story. I encourage you to keep fighting the good fight...because without seeing someone triumph over their internal demons as you have, I don't think I would be able to either.

10/6/2008 1:14:26 AM by XFrogger, Member of Delve into Jesus since 12/13/2007

God works all things together for good, praise Him for that, i think this is one of those times, your battle has touched me in so many ways, i believe you have in effect put up signs to male and female, i for one think the way you have handled this is awsome, shows courage, takes real faith, and LOVE, i pray your wife comes to see the real you the man He created you to be, the man that made a mistake stood up to it and handled it with prayer, that wants the best for her, Lord i pray the vail over her eyes be removed, heart be softened, that her love for you be rekindled, stronger than before, i pray she forgive, with her heart, not just her mouth, i pray the spirit of pride be gone in the name of Jesus

10/6/2008 2:11:42 AM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

mrspiggy, Rhonda was raised a Pentecostal but we go to an Evangelical church. She felt that, growing up, things were too strict (she could not wear the same clothes as her school peers, church three times per week, no TV in the home, etc.). While she still professes her faith to be strong, she doesn't seem as motivated to attend church as she did the first half of our marriage. She says she prayed for months to regain her love for me but that her prayers were not answered. If I had to make a call on this, I'd say her faith is somewhat luke warm at this point... although I feel nobody but Christ can look into the heart of another so please take my opinion in that light. One problem is that my faith was never close to being as strong as it now is, but Rhonda seems to think I'm using it as a ploy to draw her back to me. When I try to speak to her about God's plan, faith, forgiveness, etc., it seems to only enforce her belief that I'm trying to manipulate her. She says I'm "pushing her". Perhaps this is her way of rejecting that which she knows to be true but is interfering with HER plans... HER decision. If she only really knew how hard I've prayed and how much He has helped me in my time of grief... how my life and heart has changed because of his intervention. I asked her: With my business in jeapardy and my marriage exploding in front of my eyes, is it so hard to accept that I would turn to Him? And when he answered my plea, of course my faith would be restored... exceeding the strongest faith of my past. Time will prove to her who I really am, if she doesn't shut me out completely before that can happen. For every scripture-rooted point I make, she has an answer (i.e., that she has forgiven me but that doesn't change the fact that my past infidelity killed her love for me). If she could just sit down with some women of faith and talk about these issues, perhaps we could avert a tragedy. Like I've said before, I know my wife... if she moves out, she'll never come back. I asked her if she'd consider joining a Christian group for women considering divorce and she said she doesn't think there are any... but there are secular groups like that. I'd rather she not go at all as opposed to going to a secular group because I know their focus is more on "moving on" than forgiveness and restoration of love. While cards are being put out on the table, I should give you more insight. Rhonda has her own issues that precede our marriage. Her past indicates that she didn't walk His path - quite the contrary. I won't get into specifics but it should suffice to say that her life was "on the wild side". She has personal issues that go back to her childhood (feelings that she was the black sheep of the family, etc.). Things are fine for her when they're easy, but when they're hard, she often bails out... she somewhat lacks tenacity and, in some areas, responsibility. That may seem to conflict with the fact that she stuck with me after my "crash", but she now tells me she stayed because of financial reasons, to preserve a home life for our son, etc. I think that is a reason of convenience suiting her position today because we did have closeness, love and harmony after my "crash" - even considering the hardships we endured during my recovery period. Rhonda always has to win the "argument", issue, or debate. She rarely takes responsibility for her own actions - its always someone else's fault. In addition to my past transgressions as a reason for leaving, she references not wanting to be a step mother to my two daughters. She says she would have been a better step mother and she wouldn't now feel this way if I had been a better husband and not created her depression. Now she no longer wants the step mom role. I think Rhonda had unrealistic expectations of marriage. My transgressions not withstanding, I think she has a case of "the grass is greener on the other side of the fence". I don't think she was prepared for the reality of marriage... that fires do break out and that love and forgiveness are the extinguishers. But I truly love her... for better or for worse. I let go of many of the small issues that created conflict between us before (i.e., I'm a neat freak / she is toward the other end of the scale). For many, many months, I've come to accept and love her for who she is. I hope this helps you to better understand what's going on here. I know I should stop saying "thanks" all the time, but - THANKS for your support, advice, and prayers.

10/6/2008 12:19:48 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Trouble comes in threes The business that I own took a major blow back in August that may still destroy it. If it goes down, I could lose everything I own including my house. Then my marriage came under fire. I prayed thanks to Him that, at least, my children were safe and healthy. At about 9:00 pm last night, my oldest daughter became very ill with severe abdominal distress and vomiting. I stayed up with her until abut 3:00 am when it became unbearable for her so I took her to an urgent care center. The doctor thinks its a virus but I've never seen a virus create so much pain (she said it was an 8.5 - 9 on a scale of 1 - 10). She was writhing and crying out in pain. They gave her two shots - one for pain and one for nausea). After a half hour, the pain meds kicked in and I then took her home. Now the pain shot has worn off and her pain has returned at the same severity. It breaks my heart to see her suffer so much. I feel so helpless because there is little I can do for her. In the middle of all this, I have to hear my wife talk on the phone to her real estate broker about the details of her house. I fear I'll break down in front of her because I want to appear strong, in control, and not as if I'm trying to gain her sympathy. I believe satan is trying to break my faith. I've prayed that God will give me the strength to withstand this barrage. I'm not sure if it's OK, but while I was driving this morning to buy some essentials for my daughter, I got very angry and called out satan for this attack... I yelled at him to leave me and my family alone... that my faith in God would not be rocked by this for I know from where this assault comes - and that only strengthens my faith. But I'm overwhelmed by all of this. To top this all off, my dog is throwing up all over the house - perhaps he has the same virus as my daughter has. That "good feeling" I had just a day or two ago has vanished. Lord Jesus, what else do you want from me? I've searched my soul to see if there is anything else I should be doing. I will not resist You, just tell me what You want from me and I'll be obedient. Please help my daughter, for she is suffering so much. Please give me strength and deliver me from satan's assault. Amen. Please pray that this all ends soon. I really don't know how much more I can take.

10/6/2008 12:52:38 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, It is truely the love of God that causes us to change. I hope you will accept this next statement in love. Rhonda is a prodical at this point. She is exhibiting the same signs that other prodicals exhibit (rebellion, selfishness, unwilling to compromise, fault-finding, etc.) If she stayed before because of finances; my question is: did she win the lottery? Whatever issues she has will remain until she returns to God. Don't hold anything against her, she has been deceived by the evil one. Just like Eve. Forgive her for she knows not what she is doing. There is a website for standers and prodicals. I will sent it to you later.

10/6/2008 12:59:45 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

I think one of the reasons Rhonda is leaving now is because my son is 8 years old and she feels she can now get a job. That is her "lottery".

10/6/2008 1:19:16 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Satan has now attacked your child! It's time to go to war. Get dressed for battle. Put on belt of truth (nothing is impossible with God),and your breastplate of righteousness (you are in right standing with God because you confessed your sin to Him, was forgiven and forgave yourself), your shoes from the gospel of peace(the peace of Jesus, knowing that you will win the battle), the shield of faith (the battle is not yours, it's God's), the helmet of salvation (greater is He that is in you than he that is in the world) and the sword of the Spirit which is the word of God (speak His word out loud over your circumstances) Declare the promises of God over your life. His Word says you are blessed in the city and in the country. Your children are blessed. Your business is blessed. You are blessed when you come in and when you go out. Read Deuteronomy 28:1-14. His Word does not return to Him void.

10/6/2008 1:43:02 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Unless Rhonda turns back to God, she will not succeed.

10/6/2008 1:44:17 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

XFrogger, What is astounding is that, even though my faith was tepid, of which He would spit from His mouth, He heard my prayers and did not forsake me. That is what strengthened my faith and all the glory for this is His, not at all mine. Sadly, I treated my relationship with God as one does with their attorney. You don't call him unless you've been served with a lawsuit. For that, I am ashamed. I'll never make that same mistake again as I've been served with several doses of reality. Actually, it shouldn't be surprising that my faith would grow in the midst of such storms. I believe He uses them to reel back in those who are falling away from him. When it seems like you have nothing left but your faith, you tend to give it the focus it deserves. When you need His intervention, and He delivers, His gift is far greater than merely addressing the issue d'joure. His deliverance gives you a firm foundation on which to build a lasting faith. Now it is my responsibility to preserve and grow it by my future actions, prayer, reading His word, and by worshiping Him. At age 50, I no longer need to be taught such lessons twice. mammak, I do not feel courageous. I constantly have to remind myself that it is in His hands, not mine. He has granted me moments of respite, of confidence, and even joy. But I'm still dealing with a lot and I feel like I struggle to stand sometimes. I feel like a battle for my soul has ensued and I'm in the crossfire. Please remember, my faith is predominantly a new found faith. I've been used to dealing with the pressures and tragedies of life by myself. Now that they're too big for me to handle, I'm having to relearn how to give my problems to the Lord. I'm sure my inexperience in this makes it that much more difficult for me. It's like going directly from boot camp to the battle field. I thank Him that he has sent so many of His wonderful followers to give me counsel, advice, prayer and support.

10/6/2008 2:58:38 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

I believe it's harder to stand when it's your child, but for your child you MUST, show them how to go to God in faith and trust, you said your faith is the strongest it's ever been, think how horrible it is for those that don't know Him, HOPELESS, we all need hope a way out, He is the way, look around you read the news, it will grip your heart, being a christian makes you a target, just be a moving one, iv'e been a christian about 10 years, for awhile i was thinking life was better before i knew Him, i put no stock in satan, even used to think,how silly are people, to believe such a thing i used to think they were sad people, then one day i voiced, my thoughts about satan, i paid no mind to that part of the preaching, then i understood, i was shocked, i really was, then it hit me, I WASN'T GOING TO BE BEATEN BY A LOOSER, best thought i ever had, we will have trials, satan hates us so much, BUT, IN MY MIND HE ONLY HAS THE POWER MY FEAR GIVES HIM, fear is a sin, God can't be where sin is, fear is the opposite to FAITH, i'm making it sound so easy, i wish it was, it's a choice, i choose FAITH, i choose Him, be like the eagle soar above the storm, go to the highest mountian, rest in the warmth of the Son, renew your strength. Lord i ask you now to heal this child take away the pain, let her see your hand in all of this, bless this family, i ask for all thats been stolen returned 7 fold= health, relationship, love, forgivness, time, wealth, JOY, PREACE,and more NOW in the name of Jesus name above all names. God bless, remember your a winner you come from victory, you don't have to fight for it Jesus did that for us, thank Him by STANDING, IN faith.

10/6/2008 5:08:11 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

My daughter is doing better, but she is still very tired and has some pain. Thanks for all your prayers.

10/7/2008 10:27:04 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Hi Dan - I'm glad to hear she is feeling better; we will continue praying for your family!

10/7/2008 10:33:25 AM by Ryan, Member of Delve into Jesus since 12/30/2007

An Update After seeing Fireproof and spending a weekend with her family, Rhonda decided to rent a different house that offers a 6 month lease instead of the other one which required 1 year. She said she did this just in case we reconcile. I believe her change was also influenced by the fact that the rent is somewhat less. She submitted her lease this morning so, if things go her way, she'll be moving out next week. We still haven't told our son - a task which breaks my heart beyond description. I believe he is going to take it much harder than Rhonda thinks he will. While I have placed this in God's hands, I still am feeling crushed by all of this. I'm torn between maintaining hope that we'll get back together with accepting what appears to be the end of my marriage. She talks to me about bedroom sets, the layout of her house, her income opportunities she's considering for her independent life, etc., and doesn't seem to see that hearing these things cuts me like a saber. I left her bible on her pillow with a sticky note referencing 2 Chronicles 2:7 "so that on the contrary you should rather forgive and comfort him, otherwise such a one might be overwhelmed by excessive sorrow." She remains seemingly oblivious to my sorrow and responds with references to the sorrow I caused her back then. Lord Jesus Christ, son of almighty God, please guide Rhonda back to the loving woman of faith she was when I married her. Please open her eyes to Your desire for her to forgive so that she, herself, can be forgiven... that she may heal and soften her heart... and so she may find through her faith the peace and happiness You have promised. Fend off, dear Lord, the worldly influences that now motivate her to throw away Your blessing of our marriage. Help her see that marriage is a covenant with You, and not merely a contract that is easily nullified with an order from the state. And please, Lord, please... open her eyes to the depth and purity of the steadfast love I have had for her during the years of my healing. Even as she chastises and berates me with her anger... even as she prepares to abandon me at a time when my business is in trouble... a time I truly need my wife, I feel only love for her. Dear God, please open her eyes to see that mine is a true love and not merely need. Thank you, Lord, for giving me the strength to carry on... for placing each of my footsteps on Your path. Thank you for providing relief for my daughter and for helping her heal. In the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, I pray. Amen.

10/7/2008 6:33:55 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

First, Lord i ask that You bless this young boy, i pray for wisdom beyond his years, that Your hand be on him, that his parents have the right words to help him, Thank You Lord that You are healing his sister, i pray no weapon formed against them prosper, in Jesus name. Only have your hope and trust in His word = HE WORKS ALL THINGS, He answers prayer, He gives us the desires of our hearts, proverbs 3:5-6. My daughter once said to me "hate the sin not the sinner" let your wife get to that point, she won't get there through anything you say, maybe you should stop leaving scriptures for her she won't respond to you, at this point, so she is reading them with her back up, let her come across them His way, He knows when her heart will be opened, the only way is to let go and let God. Jeremiah 29:11. God bless

10/8/2008 2:33:00 AM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

One more week She will be moving out next Thursday... and the reality of knowing the day has hit me like a freight train. While I continue to pray to our Lord that He awakens me from this nightmare, it continues. I cannot describe the despair that has overtaken me - in spite of my prayers to Him for relief. Sometimes I feel His presence and my mind clears to the reality that this separation could lead to saving my marriage. It may serve to finally wipe the marriage slate clean of past transgressions so that the love my wife may still have for me may one day reemerge. But it may also (perhaps most likely) lead to the day when divorce papers toll the funeral bells of the love she once had for me. I have taken all of your advice (which I sincerely appreciate) and continue to pray to Him for courage, strength, hope, and to heal my marriage. I accept that He hates divorce, wants to give His faithful good things, has forgiven me, and has made His presence known to me. But still despair seems to overtake me. Sometimes I feel like I'm standing on the brink of the precipice and have thoughts of the worst course of action but my responsibility to my children have prevailed. Then I feel guilty for not having enough faith in Him that He will deliver me from this chasm. I do have faith in Him and read the book of Job for reassurance. But these feelings of despair are so overwhelming... which conflict with my faith in His promise, causing me to question if my faith is hollow. I ask once more for your prayers. I know He listens to them.

10/9/2008 11:01:34 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

I can only imagine what you are going through... I am praying for you. Hang on and trust Jesus.

10/9/2008 1:41:16 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

I see you as a man of FAITH, sitting here i can say a lot of things, give a lot of scriptures, may even be spot on, but your sitting there hurting desperate, i can only pray that i'd be strong enough to reach out in prayer as you have and be ...a warning sign to others in so many ways, eg...it's a beautiful day your driving theres a sign "WARNING, drive carefully area prone to rock fall" THANK YOU. I don't want to offend, i'll say sorry incase......i believe your fine, will be fine, because your feet are on the rock, yes your flesh is hurting, i'd be worried if it wasn't, in this your wife is blocking God's hand, He won't come against our freewill, she has hardened her heart at this time, she may even like the the idea of, sort of being single, either way she is being decieved, but praise God she has a loving praying husband, trust His timing, think about it you have noyhing to loose, at this point she is going, you could say,that's it's i give up, then yes it will be over, but standing in faith gives you hope, Sarah was told she would have a baby, when it didn't happen she made it happen, she wasn't in faith she didn't trust his timing, you know the story, when Mary was told you will have a baby she said how? she had faith, she trusted His timing, Jesus was born. Get a vision, see your wife home, speak of when she will be back, give that life, not the now, remember God spoke this world into being, the power of words. prayony for your son.

10/9/2008 4:23:22 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

I asked Rhonda if she prayed everyday. She said, "Yes, but I don't like get on my knees... I pray as I'm going through my day." I suggested that she take a few minutes each day and sit quietly so that her prayers are focused and sure, and not trivial (i.e., God, I wish it wasn't so hot out today.) I think my suggestion fell on deaf ears. Just as some of you have concluded, I believe she has fallen away from the Lord. I'm not even sure she has faith at all... that what I perceived as faith may just be a remnant of her strict Pentecostal upbringing. So I'm now going to focus most of my prayers on her. As it says in 1 Corinthians 7:14 "For the unbelieving husband is sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified through her believing husband". In the name of our Heavenly Father, I pray that You will forgive me for my recent weakness in faith. The evil that came into our lives has destroyed our marriage and Rhonda's faith. Lord, please guide her away from the world and back to the cross of salvation. Please come into her heart once more and restore her faith and her spirit by your intervention. She is a good woman, Lord, and my love for her is so great that it could only have come from Your blessing. Please save her from self-destruction and restore her love for me. Jesus, let me one day hold her in my arms again and feel the closeness of her heart against mine. She's not even gone yet from my home, and I already miss her immensely. Lord Jesus, please protect her and heal her... let her suffer no more from the transgressions of my past but grant her the courage to forgive me. And please protect my son who is the innocent victim of his parent's failures. In the name of Jesus Christ I pray, Amen.

10/9/2008 7:03:09 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Father God, We thank You that You are always mindful of us, your children. We thank You that when one lamb strays from the fold, You go retrieve that one lost lamb, place him/her on Your shoulders and bring him/her home again. We lift up Rhonda to You and ask that You bring her back home to You and Your marvelous love. We ask that You heal her hurting heart and forgive her sin. Restore her to Your righteousness so that she may again be the wife You created her to be. Your timing is perfect, so we await Your intervention with great expectation. Comfort our brother, Dan as he faithfully await Your move. We mourn with him now, knowing that we will rejoice with him soon. We thank You for restored marriage, renewed love, and endless joy. All in the name of Jesus we pray, amen.

10/9/2008 8:49:40 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Brother Dan Praise God that you are not Job. Your friends here know that God has forgiven you and you are in right standing with Him. Your prayers are heard by the most High God, who happens to be your Father. Everything you have done is covered by the Blood of Jesus and the work He has done at the cross. He said He would remember your sin no more. As far as the east is from the west is how far your transgression is from His thoughts. You don't have to remind Him. Just accept His love, mercy and righteousness as freely as He gives it to you. We all love you in Christ and will keep you and your family lifted up before the throne of grace. You are not alone

10/9/2008 8:56:30 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Rhonda told my son about her and him moving out. He seems to be OK with things, although he asked how long it would be before "we come back". That was a tough question to answer. I've prayed for God to protect him from this storm. The bad news just keeps coming. A very major project I was hoping would come to fruition to help save my company from sinking was postponed indefinately... at least a year. I've told the Lord that "I give! I completely give myself over to You - there's no need for me to take any more hits." As with the other catastrophes in my life, I gave this one to Him as well. I'll just keep having faith that He has not abandoned me for I trust His word. Sometimes I feel Him comfort me and I feel profound peace. Other times I feel all alone. I've prayed more in the past few weeks than I have in the past two years. Nothing has changed with Rhonda. I tried to talk her into going to church with me tomorrow. She was resistant and then told me not to "push" her. I continue to pray for her often. Thanks for all your continued prayers for me and my family. I know there are those who have it far worse than I so I hope I'm not depending on you all too much.

10/11/2008 5:42:59 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

God is right with you. "How precious also are thy thoughts unto me, O God! how great is the sum of them! If I should count them, they are more in number than the sand: when I awake, I am still with thee." Psalm 139:17-18

10/11/2008 7:37:31 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

Brother Dan, He Who keeps watch over you neither sleeps nor slumbers. He is always with you. I attended a marriage seminar today. First things first, we were told we must have our priorities in order. God, spouse, children, work, everything else. It's best when both partners have these priorities, but God (I love those two words) But God can and will work it out if only one person in the marrisge has these priorities and stand firm in them.You cannot waver. You cannot become doubleminded about what you expect God to do in your life. Your manifestation cannot rise above what you really expect from God. You are His son and should expect the best to come your way at all times in every situation. Just because the project has been postponed, doesn't mean it will not come to fruition. We are bound by time, God isn't. And once you enter the kingdom of God, you are not bound by the economy of this world. Your Father has promised to bless you according to HIS riches in glory, not the world's riches. You are aware that He can and will move suddenly, right? Now that you have given Him your all, watch Him work. Stand still and see the power of the Almighty God, your Father. Stand still, be quiet, pray and watch. Stop trying to work it out yourself. Leave Rhonda alone. If she feels asking her to church is "pushing her". Stop. As the world says it: Grin and bear it. Smile. God is with you, He is not with your enemy. No weapon formed against you shall prosper if you trust Him. Read Psalm 91 until you get it down in your spirit. Read your Bible until there is no doubt left in you. Jesus said, "If you abide in Me and My word abide in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you." John 15:7

10/11/2008 8:42:59 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

It sounds like you are in the "Wilderness." But please remember, God is there with you. There are two very important lessons you will learn in the wilderness. One: You are powerless. Two: God is totally in control.

10/11/2008 9:01:57 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

Thanks to my prayer warriors for your responses and sound advice. After reading your postings, I am back on the upswing of my roller coaster ride... more optimistic, more secure in my faith. On the issue of the postponement of the project, I only have resources to keep the doors open another three or four months. However, I didn't mention that I am pursuing two other non-related options that I believe He provided for me. My core business has been in the area of developing new businesses and facilities for health care. The economy and other factors have basically killed my core market for now. A few months ago, literally less than an hour after the first "shoe dropped" for my business, I received a phone call from a business associate who suggested opportunities in completely different lines of business. As it's turned out, these opportunities may be even better than what I've been doing for the past 14 years. I see this as God closing a door that was leading to nowhere and opening one that is far better for me. So, while I was dismayed to lose the "quick fix", I trust that He is providing me with a greater blessing. I'll be able to focus our time and attention to these new ventures which, in view of the state of the economy, are turning out to be much better. Praise the Lord!!! Just as I know He is guiding me out of my business problems, I have faith that he is in full control of my marital crisis. The latter, however, has far greater emotional impact on me so it seems much harder to maintain a sense of peace and confidence He is providing for me. From what I've read about the emotional phases people go through in these situations, my reactions are to be expected. I know I must continue to increase my faith... maybe that's the path He intends. Your encouragement to trust in the Lord is what I needed to hear. I must fight against these negative feelings and rejoice in the knowledge that He truly is with me and has His hand firmly on the wheel. I'm actually getting better at it... I'm training myself to, at the first sign of negativity, to pray and pray hard. While my flesh burns, my spirit is soaring. As I've said in the past, I've never had such a close relationship with God before. I'm amazed at how He works... how He can make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. But I'm going to need to prepare myself for the next five days to come as Rhonda starts packing and, on Thursday, moves. I plan on spending that evening in Church by myself.

10/11/2008 10:05:40 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Your son asked how long till he comes back, i like that, bless his young heart, you call them hits, they are, He is with you in all of them, He has faith in you to come through, 13:5b, hits will come, satans plans to destroy you with them, God plans to strengthen you through them, look back over your life see the hits, they are history, you won, you are winning again, you are stronger, in Him, with Him, you are in control, because you give it all to Him. Keep it up, YOU are VICTOR, not a victim, satan HAS to RETURN ALL he has STOLEN. praise God. proverbs 3:5-6. matthew6:34. psalms 23 &91 God Bless you all

10/12/2008 7:47:27 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

She's gone I left home this morning before the movers came so I wouldn't have to witness that. It was a sad goodbye... 9 years together with 5 of those married. I told her to ask God to show her His path and that I hoped that path would lead her back to me. I went back home later... the emptiness of the house surpassed only by the emptiness in my heart. I cannot explain all the things I'm feeling now... most of them profoundly sad, but a few are good. And on that note, among those good feelings are those I got from the hands you all reached out to me... a stranger who showed up on your site with a sad story and no other place in which to turn. Your prayers, advice, guidance and moral support helped me to forgive myself, understand His love for me, and, sometimes, kept me from falling apart completely. You are all blessed people and I thank you from the bottom of my heart. You are all in my prayers as I thank Him for sending me His servants in my hour of need. May He pour his rewards upon you without end. My faith in God remains strong... stronger than it has ever been in my lifetime. I have found peace in self-forgiveness and in the knowledge that He has forgiven me as well. Only by my faith will I prevail in this storm, for without Him I know I am lost. While my battle to keep her from leaving me was lost, I will remain Rhonda's husband regardless of where she lives or what papers may be filed with the state. I pray to Jesus that He will bring her back to me someday, but I understand that that may not be His plan for me. So I have accepted that I must be patient while He does His work. Perhaps He will open her heart to me once more and the pain of the past will be no more. I can only pray. Heavenly Father, thank You for leading me to Your servants who have faithfully done Your work. They gave of themselves selflessly and for Your purpose. Like the good Samaritan, they gave their time, energy, and love to a total stranger in his time of need. Please, Lord Jesus, bless them for their work and sacrifice. Protect them and grant them the endless bounty of Your love. They are among Your finest children. Amen

10/16/2008 7:22:10 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Nothing is over till God says so, is He saying that to you? I really am sorry, i wish i had the right words to make it better, but where this has taken you is amazing, where would you be without your faith, or hope, trust a lot worse than now, don't give up, remember a seed must be put in the ground, so it can die in order to grow. Thank you for praying for us, seeing the way you are letting go and letting God is a blessing to me, i pray for the day to come when we read SHE IS BACK Now as you visit your son, ect your wife will see the real man you have become, God bless you in all you do and your family, i pray NO weapon formed against you and your family shall prosper in Jesus name

10/16/2008 7:52:54 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

It's not over. Spend this time with Father. Seek His comfort, guidance and wisdom. There is so much you have to do and need to be centered and focused to get it all done. Read and believe His word. Get yourself a good concordance. Look up all His promises in the concordance. Then study them day and night until they become part of you. Claim them in the name of Jesus. Then, while you're watching them come to pass, Rhonda will return. Do not let her be your focus. Let Him be your focus. Be His ambassador. While you're working on His purpose, He'll be working on yours. I stand in agreement with Mammak, waiting to read yoour post, She is back. Every test leads to a testimony. You have stood and shown yourself faithful. He is not done with you yet. Be confident of this, that He Who began a good work in you, will complete it. (Phillipians 1:6)

10/17/2008 8:31:57 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

"How amiable are thy tabernacles, O LORD of hosts! My soul longeth, yea, even fainteth for the courts of the LORD: my heart and my flesh crieth out for the living God. Yea, the sparrow hath found an house, and the swallow a nest for herself, where she may lay her young, even thine altars, O LORD of hosts, my King, and my God. Blessed are they that dwell in thy house: they will be still praising thee. Selah. Blessed is the man whose strength is in thee; in whose heart are the ways of them. Who passing through the valley of (tears) Baca make it a well; the rain also filleth the pools. They go from strength to strength, every one of them in Zion appeareth before God. O LORD God of hosts, hear my prayer: give ear, O God of Jacob. Selah. Behold, O God our shield, and look upon the face of thine anointed. For a day in thy courts is better than a thousand. I had rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God, than to dwell in the tents of wickedness. For the LORD God is a sun and shield: the LORD will give grace and glory: no good thing will he withhold from them that walk uprightly. O LORD of hosts, blessed is the man that trusteth in thee." PSALM 84:1-12

10/18/2008 12:09:54 AM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

Trying to keep my faith Before Rhonda moved out, I thought the few days leading up to her departure would be the worst for me. I was wrong. Every day that passes I fear her heart is moving that much farther away from me. I feel guilty when my fear and anguish overtakes my spiritual common sense... like I should have more trust and faith in God. I try, and sometimes I feel like I'm succeeding. It seems worse late at night. When I do sleep, I wake up reaching for her but she's not there. Then I might as well just get up. Last night was my roughest night yet. After an hour or so of not being able to sleep, I got up and stayed up the whole night. It was especially tough because I was home alone this weekend - my children were not here... not even my dog who Rhonda took. In a moment of weakness, I drove over to her house and woke her up at 7:30 am. She wasn't happy, to say the least. I apologized profusely and tried to explain the level of my anguish but that didn't phase her. I promised her that I'd never do that again. Rhonda backed out of going with me to church this morning. I acknowledge that she has a lot to do... unpacking, getting her house in order, etc., so I understand. Too bad, though. Today's sermon was "unconditional love" targeting all types of relationships but mostly marriages. It was like Pastor Dan had written it just for Rhonda and me. I sat through most of the service with tears streaming down my face. An elderly gentleman just to my left in the row behind me must have seen my pain so he placed his hand on my shoulder. Just then Pastor Dan talked about how the congregation should be viewed as one source of unconditional love. Even though Rhonda didn't come with me, I was sure glad I went. My faith was bolstered. After the service, there are two prayer volunteers at the front of the church. The lady who prayed for me and my family was wonderful... she said many of the same things you all have been telling me - that I should just pray to Jesus for guidance, peace, to surround myself in a shield of Christ's blood, to double my efforts to seek out His word, and to leave Rhonda to Him. Her prayer was powerful. One part of the sermon talked about giving unconditionally to those we love... even if it hurts. So, after church I went to Rhonda's house and spent the afternoon putting together some of the furniture she bought. It was hard... especially when it came to putting together part of her bedroom set (you can imagine why). But I now feel like I did what God wants me to do. I'll keep trying my best to follow all of the good advice I've received from all of my supporters. I know He is with me.

10/19/2008 7:54:09 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Praise God, how awsome are you, when you are helping Ronda you are showing her the real man you are, the one that is made in His image, that loves enough to rise above his own feelings, for her, God bless you, i am very proud of you, this wasn't going to be easy, but worth it, when you can't sleep put some praise and worship on works for me, even a sermon, maybe He want's you to read the word. i mean when you can't sleep. Ronda may have moved away from you, the old you maybe, but how else was she going to see the REAL you, back then she couldn't see past her, anger fear hurt what ever, give her time, SORRY give Him time, start thanking Him for the out come now, in Jesus.name, Matthew 6:33-34.1 John 3:18

10/19/2008 11:23:34 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

mammak, Thanks for the advice and suggested scripture - especially Matthew 6:33-34. I've added it to my "read frequently list". In case you haven't noticed (chuckle!), I'm a bit of a worry-wart... in some cases, this has served me well in the past because it helped me maneuver through some of life's obstacles. But that is a remnant of my past's weak faith in Him - when I tried to rely solely on myself. I'm relearning how to deal with problems... especially those which are too big for me to handle without His help or, in cases like my marriage, too big for me to handle at all. I know I have a lot to learn. When this storm clears, I plan on reading the Bible from cover to cover. I've set a one-year goal in which to do so. For now, I'm going to focus on the scripture that is applicable to my situation. Rhonda informed me this evening that she has read this entire thread. I encouraged her to post her own thoughts, feelings and impressions about our and her personal situation. I totally believe God has used this vessel for His work on me. Perhaps it will help her as well. Dear Lord Jesus, I have filled your ears with my prayers for help, strength, forgiveness, courage, guidance and fortitude. In those prayers, I have insufficiently thanked You for Your intervention into my life. Now I want to focus my prayer completely on my thanks to You. Even though I am not worthy of Your love, You love me. I am filled with sin but You forgive me. In my time of doubt, You responded to my stubbornness with an irrefutable miracle proving Your presence to me. When I am in anguish, You comfort me. When I am weak, You strengthen me. When I am filled with despair, You fortify me. My cup runneth over with all of Your love and many blessings. Thank You, Lord Jesus... thank You for my life, for my children, for making sure that we have never been without the essentials of earthly life. Thank You for forgiving me of all of my horrible past sins. I wish to thank You with more than my mere words, but by my actions. My ears, mind, and heart is open to Your guidance, Dear Lord. If I appear deaf, please speak loudly to me. I wish to live my life according to Your plan so that it may glorify You. In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, I pray. Amen.

10/21/2008 12:44:32 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

I am encouraged, my worry wart friend your doing great, i pray for more men like you, you have let your faith grow through this, you even have a plan, it's one He that blesses Him, all He asks is for all of you, God bless you, as you read His word, Holy Spirit fill him as he reads i pray your eyes be open , that the word speaks that you hear with an open heart, that His plan for your life be revealed in Jesus name, that your family be blessed, i like that you see this as a storm that will clear, after a storm there is a rainbow, look for it, i pray Rhonda be blessed and for His will for her life in Jesus name. Lord bless Dan to be a blessing. Thank you, i'm sorry but it's been a joy to pray and watch you grow. Remember the rainbow

10/21/2008 1:49:05 AM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

I'm confused Rhonda and I went to our second counseling session today. I prayed for Jesus to guide my words before the session. I came prepared to accomplish what I thought was important at this point. I brought the "Survivor to Thriver" Manual and Workbook for adult survivors of child abuse who want to move-on with life. From that, I referenced various portions to demonstrate that 1: at the time of my transgressions, I didn't know I had a deep-seated dysfunction, 2: that victims of child abuse do self-destructive things to those they love because they feel ashamed and unworthy of love, 3: that my actions were text book examples of the dysfunctions of child abuse victims. I then pointed out that, if instead of this problem, I had Turrets Syndrome (where uncontrolled words (often hurtful) come out of the mouths of those afflicted), that a Christian spouse would not abandon their spouse but would love them despite their affliction. While there are some differences with that problem and mine, I still never asked for this horrible dysfunction - that it would have been different if I had just been a self-centered pig who selfishly violated his spouse's trust without regard to her feelings and our marriage vows. And finally, I read from 1 Corinthians 13:4-8 defining "love" as God sees it - that "it keeps no record of wrongs... it always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres". I also read from 1 Corinthians 7:10-11 "a wife shall not separate from her husband". Our counselor chastised me for "stating my case like I'm in a court of law" - that I should not even address any of this, that Rhonda was wronged by my past infidelity and that I was responsible - regardless of what happened to me as a child. I respectfully fought back. I said that my concern was that I believed Rhonda had only forgiven me with her mouth and not her heart, despite my demonstrated fidelity thereafter as well as my efforts and progress to eliminate my anger responses. If she does not truly forgive me, then Christ can not forgive her. As our focus is on her healing, I stated that I brought up all of this so that she could come to terms with the past and expunge it from her heart and soul. The counselor accused me of trying to put a guilt trip on Rhonda. That was the farthest thing from my mind. I merely wanted to ensure that she had an open door to working through her problems... that unless she could finally forgive me for my past transgressions, that there could be no reconciliation (for her, individually and for our marriage). The counselor accused me of healing for the sake of saving my marriage instead of for the purpose of healing myself. Again I fought back - that the horrors my dysfunction caused in my entire life before Rhonda were my motivations to cast out those demons... that unless he had suffered himself from child abuse, that he had no idea how much pain and suffering one must endure prior to treatment. At this point, Rhonda did stand up for me... telling the counselor that she was sure I was trying to heal for my own self. I should note that, before our first joint session a few weeks ago, Rhonda saw this counselor for some time. I wonder if he doesn't have some bias or preconceptions about me as a result. He is a member of our church which is were we got the referral. It just seemed to me like his positions are contrary to all I've learned about God's plan for marriages, His instructions on love and forgiveness, etc. From my perspective, his actions were very detrimental in that they fed Rhonda's stubbornness to forgive and to avoid reconciliation. We are to have only one more joint session next week in which we will establish ground rules for the separation. In advance of that, Rhonda said that she doesn't want me to tell her I love her anymore. The counselor agreed with her. After next week's session, we are going to see him individually. I respect all of your opinions and want to do the right thing. Please be honest with me for I seek nothing but truth. Where did I go wrong here?

10/23/2008 2:09:41 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

First i want to say, i'm sorry you were hurt when you were young, it should never have happened, when i was reading this is what i felt ..... no why did you say that, let it come out in due time, let God defend you, what was done to you was wrong what you did was wrong, 2 wrongs never make a right, i'm sorry, Jesus went to the cross wrongly, He never made any of us pay, sorry, no one should say , ok i did wrong but, back when ect ect, it you haven't deleted me, may be you need to REALLY forgive the past, then you will have the perfect NOW, JUST LIKE WHAT HAPPENED TO YOU WASN'T YOUR FAULT NEITHER IS IT RHONDAS, your children should't pay either, i'm devorced so i can speak on that, i can't speak on your case, as i haven't been through it, i have gone through other things, i choose to leave them where they should be with Him, really i hurt myself each time i give them a chance, the first time was too much.Trust the councelor, trust that he hears God, that he be Spirit led, trust the man of God that you are, just be all He created you to be, He is in control, Rhonda wouldn't be going if there was no hope in her heart. proverbs 3:5-6. matthew 6:33-34.

10/23/2008 4:21:11 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Brother Dan, Mammak is right. Forgive, forgive, forgive. Forgive those who hurt you in the past. Forgive yourself for allowing the past to encroach on your now. Forgive the counselor for not being sympathetic to your past hurts. None of us can go back. We must all forgive and let God take the hurt away. Honor Rhonda's wishes by "showing" her love instead of saying it. Question: Can you forgive Rhonda for not forgiving you?

10/23/2008 5:15:16 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

While I believe it is natural to feel hurt and rejected when your wife and mother of your son leaves you and no longer wants you to say "I love you", I do not feel animosity toward her... I only feel love for her. Sincerely, there is nothing for which to forgive her. I don't have animosity toward the counselor, either. I just think he is wrong in his assessment and worry that this is feeding Rhonda's erroneous assumption that she has forgiven me (I don't think she has). However, all that being said, I do believe that God is in control so I'm prepared to sit back and see what happens. I have also concluded that it's time for me to separate as well. Although I still love her, I see that I can no longer "carry the torch" for her. When she said that she no longer wants to hear me say "I love you", that hit home... it was sort of an epiphany for me. While I'll not discount the possibility that Rhonda and I may someday reconcile, I believe He is telling me that His path for me is leading me elsewhere. I can now proceed with the knowledge that I did my best... all I can do to save my marriage. I'll do no more to try to get her back - I'm only going to seek His path for me. That means I have to let her go from my heart as it is too painful to love someone who won't even allow you to say those words. I'm not stupid - her position on that speaks volumes. While she talks of how my past actions affected her feelings for me, her current actions and words are surely taking a toll on mine... lessening my ability to trust that, if we do ever get back together, that she won't bail on me again. I'm going to now focus on myself, my children, and my businesses. Rhonda is officially on her own. Thanks for your (always great) advice.

10/23/2008 5:53:42 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Now, God can use you. You said, "While I still love her, I see that I can no longer carry the torch for her." That quickened something in my spirit. That's how Jesus feels!! He's been hit, scratched, spit upon, whipped, and crucified. All this to show His love for us. And everytime a person who is "witnessed to" turns his/her back, that person leaves Jesus "carrying the torch". So, when people ask why God "sends" others to hell, that's the answer! How long is Jesus suppose to carry the torch for you?" Make sure your heart is in agreement with your mind. Accept it all before you move on. Keep God first in your life. As for trusting that she won'y bail out on you should you get back together; your trust is in God, not her. Forgive and heal. Pray for others (including Rhonda) and let the Holy Spirit intercede for you. I will pray for Rhonda, but know that your prayers for her carry more weight than mine because of your covenant with her.

10/23/2008 6:47:00 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Brother, Please know that I am not trying to minimize your hurt. I just know that in all things, God gets the glory!! He has use of your pain. Give it to Him. You have blessed EVERY woman that's visited this site, whether she responded or not. We salute the divinity in you!!

10/23/2008 7:28:58 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Wow, mrspiggy... I never made that connection (carrying the torch) but it is rather profound. As far as my heart and my mind being in agreement, I have faith that He is leading both of them. My love for her was so overwhelming that my heart would not follow my mind when it was telling me to trust in the Lord instead of myself. You saw how stubborn I was. Her telling me she doesn't want me to say "I love you" was the jolt my heart needed to start following my mind. As I have been, I will continue to pray for Rhonda to find God and for Him to heal all of her wounds. Based on what she's told me over the years, she has many wounds that precede the ones I inflicted. Hers is a tortured soul without peace, without trust, and without joy. Lord Jesus, I pray that You will place your hand of love and guidance on Rhonda who is now lost in the world. As You have promised, help her find her way back to You, back to Your word, back to her faith in You, and back to the path You chose for her. Bless her as she weighs her earthly desires against her spiritual needs. Give her the wisdom to seek out the truth about the TRUE sources of her displeasure and depression. Help her forgive me so that she may also be forgiven. In the name of our Heavenly Father I pray. Amen. Ezekiel 34:16 I will search for my lost ones who strayed away, and I will bring them safely home again. I will bandage the injured and strengthen the weak.

10/23/2008 7:54:23 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Dan, You mentioned that the Counselor is from your Church. Do you know him personally to be a true follower of Christ? My point is, anyone can go to Church and call themselves a Christian. (Believe it or not, my Pastor himself, testified that he Pastored a Church, taught Bible Study,etc. and after he went to a Billy Graham Crusiade, he realized he wasn't even really a Christian!) (You know them by their fruit.) Some things you have said seem like red flags to me... 1. The Counselor accusing you of things. (Putting a guilt trip on your Wife. And healing for the sake of your Marriage only, not for yourself...) 2. Your Wife and Counseor agreeing that you should not say "I love you" anymore. (Is this Biblical?) Is he charging you and Rhonda money to meet with him? I'm wondering if he really wants to see you both back together. (He would be out of a job...) He does not seem compassionate about the abuse you suffered as a Child.... Shouldn't a Counselor help you to find truth, correct problems, find hope, and feel better about your situation? (Instead of making you feel condemned?) I am praying God gives you and your wife His wisdom and protection.

10/23/2008 10:15:25 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

I was somewhat shocked by his responses. I tried to take what everyone here had given me and apply it during the session. I agree with you - his counseling style seems void of a Christian foundation. The church pays for the first 5 visits. At the risk of seeming to be defensive or self-centered, he seems to only have compassion for Rhonda. For example, he responded to my point about my past actions being the result of child abuse with "you made the mistakes... you did not act out of love for your wife... you are responsible." To that I responded that I had confessed my sins to Christ and He had forgiven me and I had forgiven myself after a long struggle to do so. NEVER ONCE did he point out any responsibility that Rhonda has (forgiveness, marriage as a covenant, etc.). I've resisted the urge to ask God why, when I sought out Christian counsel, that He would send us to someone who seems lacking in biblical principles. I trust Him that He will not forsake me and that, while His plan may appear strange or ill-fitted, it is according to His will. I sure was surprised (shocked) by his positions. I felt like the subject of an inquisition.

10/23/2008 10:36:16 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Dan, I just want you to know I have read your reply here! I will now be quiet and pray. (I will "give God room," as Franklin Graham once wrote!)

10/23/2008 10:52:05 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

An "ups and downs" update On the upside, a week ago Saturday Rhonda, with tears in her eyes told me she thought she may have made a mistake by moving out. I told her that she shouldn't second guess her decision as the separation will give us the opportunity to cleanse the evils of the past from our hearts and souls... that God's hand guided her to her decision. She also said she still loves me. I told her that I believe she will be on an emotional roller coaster for a while - some days feeling like she misses me and even loves me, and some when she does not. Perhaps I said this more to myself than to her as I don't want to get my hopes up. After we talked, she seemed to be positive. We went to church together the next day. As it has been for some time, the sermon seemed to be written specifically for us. She held my hand during one part which hit me pretty hard. On Wednesday, we had another counseling session. It went fairly well but Rhonda seemed somewhat guarded... withdrawn. A very tough night... Just when I thought I was handling things better with a glimmer of hope on the horizon, I had one of the worst nights ever last night. Last Wednesday was Rhonda's birthday. Prior to that, she asked me if I'd like to take her out to dinner on Saturday (last night). The counselor said that would be OK but that we should not discuss our situation... just spend some "normal" time together. Since Wednesday, Rhonda has become very withdrawn from me - back to being cold and even angry... as if her words of remorse and love were never spoken. The morning of our date, Rhonda canceled citing a cold and other issues. OK... things happen. But I guess her reversion back to a negative attitude toward me made me consider that she canceled because her feelings of love for me were but a fleeting hiccup. Try as I might not to get my hopes up, I guess I did. Last night was shear agony. I prayed and prayed and prayed... I read the bible until I'd doze... then I'd wake up a few minutes later feeling like someone hit me in the stomach. I've told God that he has me... body, soul, mind, and heart. I'll do whatever He wants me to do, I'll walk his path without resistance. He has my full cooperation. Please, Lord Jesus... just make this pain go away! I really cannot take anymore. I feel like I'm really breaking inside. On top of all of this, I'm also trying to heal myself from the effects of the abuse I suffered as a child. That involves regression... remembering the abuse in as much detail as possible. This is adding to my agony but it is necessary if I am to heal... if I am to become whole again... if I am to become the man that Rhonda will be able to love as her husband. I cannot put this off because it is at the apex of saving my marriage - and I only have 5 1/2 months of time left to do so. No church today Rhonda was going to go to church with me this morning but she canceled - for the same reasons she canceled our dinner last night. Just one more thing to make this whole situation to head in a negative direction. So I'm going by myself - I don't have my kids this weekend... something that made last night all the harder. This big house is like an over-sized coffin. I feel like someone has reached inside of me, grabbed my soul and ripped it out of me. So, once again... I ask for your prayers, your advice, and some suggested scriptures. Your support means so much to me.

11/2/2008 11:28:40 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, Freely I receive, so freely I give. This morning message was entitled: Kingdom Lessons from the Life of David. Here are the points: 1) Don't scorn your current place in life. (David was keeping sheep when God anointed him as king and he went on tending sheep for a while) I Samuel 16) 2) We must be fearless when facing the giants in our lives. I Samuel 17:34 3) Meditate on God's Word and His works Romans 1:20 4) Be a leader I Samuel 30:23 5) After a big success, be on guard. 6) Nothing can stop the favor of the Lord. 7) Respect and honor all authority. I Samuel 24:6 8) Men must remain productive and avoid idle time II Samuel 11:1 9) Repent quickly. II Samuel 12:1-13 10) Pick yourself up after a setback. II Samuel 12:12 11) Be passionate about God. Psalms 138, 145-150 God bless you.

11/2/2008 1:58:23 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

mrspiggy, you always seem to know what I need to hear. You are truly among His most blessed servants. More on that in just a bit, but first... Today was a special day for me. The first time I took communion was when I was confirmed in the Lutheran Church (age 15). The second time was today. In all those years, I chose not to take communion as I did not feel I had a personal relationship with God. So I now feel closer to Him and I know this will strengthen me and my faith. From your message, here's what really hit home for me: 2) 1 Samuel 17:34 If I truly have faith, then I should completely trust in Him that, with his guidance, strength and blessing, I will slay this giant which has rocked the very foundation of my world. I've come to the conclusion that satan has pulled out all stops in his effort to bring me down. As a believer, who shall win this battle? Surely it shall be God Almighty. I simply must stop trying to "fix" this myself and give it to Him... and have faith that He will not forsake me. This is where I'm weak... old habits die hard. 3) Meditate on God's Word and His works Romans 1:20 This is one of my victories. I bought a concordance bible and have been putting it through its paces - especially in the middle of the night when my anguish is at its peak. 4) Be a leader I Samuel 30:23 One who is weak cannot lead. It is time for me to cast off my tendency to agonize over my situation for that makes me weak. This all goes back to having faith in Him and His promise. It is time that I become strong and to show it. 5) After a big success, be on guard. Satan is an opportunist. He seeks to weaken my faith by following a success with a failure. I shall not let him prevail. He is also a bit dense, for when such a failure occurs, I turn to God for his strength so this backfires on him. 6) Nothing can stop the favor of the Lord. Herein lies an internal conflict for me. While I know He hates divorce and wants His followers to have abundant happiness, I also know that bad things happen to good people. Good Christian marriages sometimes end in divorce (as Rhonda so often reminds me). My prayers are generally centered around asking for Rhonda to be released from the pain I caused her and that my marriage be restored. Knowing that God's plan may not be that which I desire, I pray that He puts me on His path for me and grants me the courage to stay on that path no matter where it leads me. So my faith that He will heal my marriage is diluted by the fact that this may not be His plan for me. I then agonize over the potential that my wife and family - so very, very dear to me - may be lost forever. I just wish I knew how this is going to turn out. I know, I must be patient as He will reveal His plan to me in His own time. While I'm waiting, my suffering is beyond description. 9) Repent quickly. II Samuel 12:1-13 Here is another of my victories. I am very focused on eliminating sin from my life as my past sins have cost me dearly. I truly wish to please Him. When I identify sin in my life, I immediately ask Him for His forgiveness. I believe He has rejoiced in how I now deal with sin. 10) Pick yourself up after a setback. II Samuel 12:12 If, like the child in the story, my marriage should die as a results of my past sins (even though I've been forgiven of those sins), then I shall pick myself up like David did. Until then, not knowing the outcome is agonizing. Even more agonizing is the fact that I cannot change the past... I cannot take back that which I did to Rhonda... I cannot do much of anything to restore her love for me. I can only work on myself, to become whole again, and to finally walk in His light. Maybe she will fall in love once more with the "whole me". For this I pray many times per day. 11) Be passionate about God. Psalms 138, 145-150 My reborn faith has fostered in me a true passion for God. He gave me an unmistakable sign of His presence just a few weeks ago. Your suggestion of these Psalms has reminded me of that. Thank you, mrspiggy. Your words and time did not go for naught.

11/2/2008 3:28:31 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Dan, you said to Rondha, you will be on an 'emotional roller coaster' well don't panic,you have to believe what you say to her, let her the ride comes to an end, keep your faith, stay as strong as you have been, Proverbs 3:5-6, Philippians 4:6-7, I think the best thing for you to do is, let go and let God, if you do what He asks, and Rondha the same He can and will work it out, He has it worked out. You said in one of your posts when this settles you will read the bible in a year, read it now, soak it up, thats what we need to stay in the battle, the word of God, His plan and purpose, His promises, we can see what He has done, know what He will do, we can fend off the darts of hell, you can stand on His word and get back all thats been stolen, WE CAN SAY HERE I AM lORD USE ME, SEND ME, we can look satan in the eye and say no more it is done, we won you lost, we have hope, His joy is our peace, our strength, He has our back, for us it's up ahead, do all of our friends have the same, ask God what is the purpose of this ?what do you want me to do because of this? how can this be used for others in this boat, there a lot, see what He says, you have already touched people in many ways through this,Lord i pray You touch Dan heal his pain, give him peace, strenght, and revelation, use him Lord to bless others, to offer support, to encourage them, to stand in faith, praying, trusting, Lord Your will be done, bless Dan and his family

11/2/2008 4:36:36 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

mammak, While I certainly would like to think that some who have read my posts have benefited, I believe He has called me to go much farther. When my marriage problems are resolved (whether by victory or by divorce), I intend to help other men whose marriages are failing. For now, I see the Internet as being one vehicle. The other is that I want to start through my church a "small group" for men in troubled marriages. I am very motivated to be His witness to His plan for marriages. I want others to avoid the mistakes I made... I want them to see, before its too late, how important their wives are and how much they really do love them (even if that love is covered over by petty conflicts, worldly pressures, temptation, etc.). Most importantly, I want to show them how they must incorporate God into each and every facet of their marriage... how they need His help to put their marriages back on His course, and how truly wonderful the results can be. I take comfort in knowing that some good can come out of the horrible things I did in the past. Romans 6:23 - For the wages of sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. Thank you, Lord Jesus, for revealing to me this part of my life's path. Please help me be strong and patient prior to You revealing how my marriage will be resolved. You have instructed us to be bold in our requests, so please, Lord, please bring Rhonda and I back together... for I love her so dearly. Jesus, her absence in my life has left a hole in the middle of my soul. Please help her heal from the terrible wounds I inflicted. Help her see how far I've come... that I'm not the same person I was when I committed those terrible sins against her and You. Thank you for forgiving me, and for helping me to forgive myself. If I should stray from Your plan, or fail to hear Your word, please shepherd me back to Your course. And thank You, Dear Jesus... for all of the blessings You have bestowed upon me and my family. In the name of Christ, our Lord I pray. Amen.

11/2/2008 6:37:05 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

How amazing, God bless you, while i am so sorry that you hurt, that your family hurts, i am blessed that in this you are thinking of others, that you want to be a sign that says WARNING TAKE CARE AHEAD, so many just feel their pain, they should it's very real, iv'e been there, i wasn't thinking of others i was trying to get through and protect my 2 sons as much as possible, i didn't know the Lord then, but i still don't think i would have thought like that anyway, God bless you in all you do, i pray He gives you the desires of your heart, and many devine opportunities. God bless. PS,, the internet, is a great way of reaching so many, not just the married men, the young men even the women, not everything is the mans fault.

11/2/2008 7:19:39 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

"10) Pick yourself up after a setback. II Samuel 12:12 If, like the child in the story, my marriage should die as a results of my past sins (even though I've been forgiven of those sins), then I shall pick myself up like David did. Until then, not knowing the outcome is agonizing. Even more agonizing is the fact that I cannot change the past... I cannot take back that which I did to Rhonda... I cannot do much of anything to restore her love for me. I can only work on myself, to become whole again, and to finally walk in His light. Maybe she will fall in love once more with the "whole me". For this I pray many times per day." This is not acceptable. You DO know the outcome. Victory!! Don't keep praying for restoration, believ that you have what you asked and rejoice in the Lord. You are focused on the wrong part of the story. In verse 14, David is told that the child would die. David was praying and fasting in hope that God would change His mind. But God kept His word and the child died. Has God not told you He would restore your marriage? He keeps His word!! Why wait? Go ahead and start your group. Help other men as you have said. Don't put conditions on it. Do it to the glory of God. While you're working for Him, He'll be working for you. Your own healing is in your ministry. Just do it.

11/2/2008 9:20:45 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

AMEN AMEN and AMEN just do it.

11/2/2008 9:28:17 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

The last joint counseling session... After feeling rather victorious, the past five days did not go well for me. Literally everyone... here in Delve, my counselor, Rhonda, and the bible tell me to "give it to Jesus", back off and let Him handle it. Why is this so hard for me to do? (actually, maintain). When will I learn that she needs space to heal? I made the big mistake of addressing my issues with her - specifically a nightmare I had about what she did last Saturday night (instead of going out with me to dinner). She has since withdrawn from me. No rain checks will be forthcoming for the dinner we missed. Communication shall now be minimized. I blew it - plain and simple. We did agree that neither of us will "see" anyone else until such time that the marriage is declared officially "dead". While she's done nothing to indicate that she will not break this promise, my difficulty in trusting (from my child abuse) makes it hard for me not to conjure up demons in my mind. So I am focusing on healing myself so that I can be whole for myself, Rhonda, and my children. Rhonda and I will be seeing the counselor separately starting next week. So those are the parameters of our separation discussed in today's counseling session. She also accused me of hiding her wedding ring which I finally found on the floor between the refrigerator and the cabinet. So eroded is her trust in me that she would think I'd do such a thing. Things like this make it obvious to me that she will likely never return to me. As I've concluded in the past, I have to unplug my heart from her. I simply must let her go and put it in the Lord's hands if I'm to ever have a chance of restoring my marriage. But I've said all along... from the time she said she was moving out I knew I had lost her. This is why it has been so hard to stop trying to "fix" this myself. Only His miracle shall change this course. I'm sure by now some of you are getting tired of hearing the same old things from me. My stubbornness in giving this to God conflicts with my faith in Him. But I remain determined. So the number one thing on my daily prayer list is for Him to give me the strength to let go of the woman who means the world to me. And so I shall... Father in heaven I pray that you will have mercy on me in my time of weakness. I pray that you will give me the strength to stop trying to win her heart back and, instead, give You the reins so that You may do Your good work. Please, Lord, open Rhonda's heart to the love I know she still has for me. I ask for You to forgive me for the weakness of my faith. Only You know the depth of the love I have in my heart for her... so only You know how much help I need to sever the bond that binds me to her. I boldly ask You to restore my marriage. Please give me the chance to be the husband of her dreams. Thank you, Lord Jesus, for the countless blessings you have bestowed upon me and my family. Amen.

11/5/2008 11:07:41 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Proverbs 3:5 tells us not to lean on our own understanding, iv'e come to understand that, i have broken things that weren't broken, be cause i leant on my understanding, it wasn't easy but i have come to understand, i still have to stop myself, it's NOT OBVIOUS, she won't trust you, it's obvious she was wrong, again moving out only says at this point she has had enough, give her time, stop working it out, He can't while your doing it all for him,I feel He's saying, "OK, I'll be back when your done, so i can have room to work", i know i hear that a lot, what ever you do don't unplug your heart, let Him fill the hole, really she is not lost, picture a fight, 2 people in the ring the bell signals sit down take a break, see her sitting in her corner, she's tired let her rest, let her heal, no one has called the fight off, she needs to start remembering the good times, You said it yourself 'you have been trying so hard to fix this when only He can'. Never tired of hearing, your heart cry out to God and of your love for your wife, I don't really think your stubborn, start to focus on the ministry you want to start, remember there are men out there that need a helping hand, for that matter you bless the wifes and children, at the same time, another thing you said in this post, i pray you take in for you ' Please Lord open Rhonda's heart to the love you know she has for you' PRAISE GOD, thats the way to think and talk, God bless you.

11/6/2008 1:05:39 AM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

"If you need wisdom - if you want to know what God wants you to do - ask Him, and He will gladly tell you. He will not resent your asking. But when you ask Him, be sure that you really expect Him to answer, for a doubtful mind is unsettled as a wave of the sea that is driven and tossed by the wind. People like that should not expect to receive anything from the Lord. They can't make up their minds. They waver back and forth in everything they do." James 1:5-8 One of my favorite T-shirts reads: The world thinks Christians should be committed - So does God I pray that you commit yourself to God as strongly as you have committed yourself to having Rhonda back. He loves you with a greater intensity than you love her. He desires the attention you give her in thought and deed. You have helped me understand what is meant by "David was a man after God's heart". You are after Rhonda's heart.

11/6/2008 8:33:08 AM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

mammak, you painted a vivid picture for me (God waiting for me to get out of his way so He can do His work). I'm now on the bench. Also, I think your advice to now start working with other men in troubled marriages is worthy of consideration. It may help me as much as it might help them... and it will be doing God's service. At least it may make me feel like I'm doing more than just spinning my wheels. mrspiggy, you said, "You have helped me understand what is meant by "David was a man after God's heart". You are after Rhonda's heart." OUCH! Sometimes the truth really hurts but it is the medicine that is the only cure. I have been so blind. Of course, you are correct. I feel pretty stupid and a bit ashamed that I put my wife above God. When I rationalize the importance of God above all things, I have no problem accepting that as it is logical. I just didn't pair up logic to emotion... didn't allow it to overcome emotion. I've been crying out saying, "GOD!!! I am listening and open to your path for me!! YOU HAVE MY ATTENTION!!! Why has the journey through this dark valley not ended? What else am I to learn???" He has now answered my question. I have a lot to think about. Thanks, mrspiggy. Thank you so much!

11/6/2008 9:13:51 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, Please know that it is never my intention to hurt anyone. I realize the power of words. My purpose is to sow seed. I must be faithful to God and serve Him via my purpose. Logic has nothing to do with it. It's about obedience. There is only one sin - disobedience. Life is so simple if we just obey. Love the Lord your God with all that is within you. Love your neighbor as yourself and Believe. The Work of God that we must do is Believe.

11/6/2008 10:16:35 AM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

mrspiggy, You did not hurt me, you showed me that I was blind to the truth which I seek. Psalm 25:4-5 "Show me your ways, O Lord, teach me your paths, guide me in your truth and teach me, for you are God my Savior, and my hope is in you all day long." The "OUCH" was not caused by you, it was caused by me. I placed something (my love for Rhonda) above my love for Him. Thanks to you, I can now stop hitting my thumb with a hammer. Are all newly born again Christians as slow to learn as I? I feel like I should get one of those T-shirts I see little children wear which says, "Please be patient with me... God isn't finished with me yet." As to my reference to logic, logically I knew that my love for God should be greater than any earthly thing. I just didn't see that, by not placing this in His hands, I let my love for my wife supersede my love for God. Emotions superseded logic. Your alert to this gave me cause to consider all the things He does for me... how deep His love is for me, how much He has given me (far more than the best wife on the planet ever could) and, therefore, how much I TRULY love the Lord. I love Him enough to obey him... and, as you said, "The Work of God that we must do is Believe". I so much want to please Him. So believing that, by stepping aside and letting Him do His work, he will restore my marriage is not only the work I must do but it is to let my love for Him be my power to resist my urge to intervene. Lord Jesus, please forgive me for placing my love for Rhonda above my love for You. I am so clueless sometimes. But You have sent Your servants to my aid... You have answered my prayers for guidance... You have been infinitely patient with me - all for which I am so thankful. These gifts have allowed me to step aside and let You do Your work on my marriage. Please, Lord... please bring back to me the wife I truly do not deserve by my own actions but only by Your grace and love. Please continue to guide each and every one of my footsteps on Your path as I continue to walk through this dark place. Your love is like a beacon in the darkness of these storms which I shall continue to follow. Please help me to become whole, for I know I have so very far to go. I am nothing but the dust from which You created me and can not succeed without Your grace. Thank You for Your countless blessings. Amen. And thanks, again, mrspiggy.

11/6/2008 1:38:18 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, I love your humble spirit. To answer your question, I think there is a learning curve for all believers. I only mean to pass on the little I have learned by experience. I don't know much myself. But I do know that believers BELIEVE. That's so logical :) I think the biggest problem new borns have is not knowing what to believe. That's because the Word goes against logic. Logic says, "Seeing is believing." Jesus said believe and you will see. (I'm paraphrasing Matthew 17:20) If you believe, nothing will be impossible for you. Jesus said we should believe what WE say. So, we must be careful of what we say. There is an expression I have come to really dislike: "Don't get your hopes up" Hope is the highest level of expectation in receiving what God's word has said we can receive. I try to keep my hopes very high. My hope is that your faith does not fail. I hope you will read God's word and receive His truth into your life. I hope that your prayers are answered quickly. Seed, no time, harvest. I hope you experience many suddenlys and immediatelys in your life. I hope you walk in the fullness of what God has for you. We all need the T-shirt because God isn't finished with any of us, yet.

11/6/2008 5:06:05 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Here are some quotes I found. God bless you! Be encouraged. Dear God, Your will: nothing more, nothing less, nothing else! - Bobby Richardson Great faith is the product of great fights. Great testimonies are the outcome of great tests. Great triumphs can only come out of great trials. - Smith Wigglesworth (The prayer of faith) is a prayer willing to believe and prevail for God's answer in a situation that is utterly impossible. Regardless of the difficulty of the situation, you require no external confirmation but believe God in spite of appearance. Your eyes are on God, not on the situation. -Wesley L. Duewel--Mighty Prevailing Prayer

11/6/2008 10:57:29 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

AMEN. HOW GREAT IS OUR GOD.

11/7/2008 9:07:32 AM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

The 100th post in this thread When I saw that 99 posts had been made to this thread, I was amazed. It seems like it was only a few days ago that I came here groping for a life line. How great God is that He provides such a wonderful support system to anyone who turns to Him with a believing heart. How great God is that, thanks to Him, I'm not only standing, but I'm making progress ever since I finally gave this dilemma to Him. True, I still love and miss Rhonda - I always will - but with His grace I have been able to unplug her from my heart and accept that she most likely won't be coming back to me (I believe that is His will). I am now able to see some of the benefits of her departure... i.e., I no longer have to feel rejected by her no matter how hard I tried to be a good husband to her. So my self esteem is slowly returning and I'm starting to reconnect with that independent part of me I hadn't even realized was gone. There are no longer harsh words, heavy sighs, or feeling like I'm walking on egg shells in my household. I have even started to think about a future without her. By opening up myself to His plan... by putting myself in His hands, who knows what He may have in store for me. Thank you, Lord Jesus, for your countless blessings. You have been steadfast in Your support for me. You have used my dilemma to open my eyes to Your splendor and used me to show others how You keep Your promises... fueling the growth of their faith as well as my own. I want to tell you Lord that I love you beyond all things for you are my Father and my Savior. Please help Rhonda find healing and happiness. Please help my son continue to adjust to the detriments of a broken family. Give me the wisdom, patience and strength to be a good father and to juggle my businesses, my household, and family responsibilities. You are an awesome God! Amen.

11/8/2008 11:25:41 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

He hasn't done this, BUT He will use this, i really feel that for you. the prayers you pray for Rhonda are touching, i pray on day she reads these 100+ posts,you will have more to tell us, she will be touched, He will guide you, He will look after your family, now just be open,, let the Spirit teach you the deep things of God, i will pep you and your family in my prayers, i pray He blesses every step you take, every word you will speak, i pray every door you open be His. I pray you be full of His joy, wisdom, decernment in all things. God bless you.

11/8/2008 5:30:32 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

A Revelation This past weekend was mine with the children. While my son is eight years old, he is still very attached to his mom. To take the "edge" off of his first night back at my house, Rhonda and I decided she would stay here (I slept on the couch). We actually had a very nice weekend which included church service on Sunday. God used that opportunity to send messages to Rhonda via the sermon... one being that love is a choice, not that flash-in-the-pan emotion we enjoy in the first year or so of marriage. As our pastor said, "Love is hard, hard work! But the fruit of that work is the joy and splendor of a holy marriage if we follow His stated plan for such." The other message was the importance that we joyfully serve God in our daily lives. I think she got both messages - which are interrelated as I will get to in a minute. Janice, a member of the prayer team, prayed with me after the service. Then Rhonda and I met our pastor out in the church entrance. He prayed with us as well. Later that day, Rhonda told me that she had always prayed for a true Christian husband. I smiled at her and told her that he is here if she wants him. I prayed about all of this last night. Then, it hit me. This morning I called Rhonda and told her this: "God, in His wonderful, infinite wisdom, has used both of us for His purpose and to answer each other's main prayers of life. He brought us together so that you would be the catalyst for me to confront the demons of my child abuse, thereby bringing healing to my life. He also used you to bring me to His door. He used my pain of perhaps losing you to bring me to my knees. I believe this was your calling... part of your service to Him. Yes, it was painful service but if you look beyond the pain you'll feel joy in doing what He has called you to do. Throughout the years of my tepid faith, my main prayer was for stronger faith. In my darkest hour, He made His presence very clear to me. My faith has been permanently lifted and my resulting rebirth in Christ has answered your prayer for a Christian husband. And if we reconcile, our marriage will be so much stronger for the experience." And finally, I postulated that, if we eventually reconcile, perhaps both she and I could work together as "small group" leaders for marriage enrichment. How powerful our message would be to those who are struggling with problems in their marriages, with faith weakened by satan's attacks, and with the message that, no matter how bad things look (as they did for us), His plan, when revealed, proves that He was always there with us, working His miracles, loving us, guiding us and caring for us... all while working to answer our prayers. Rhonda listened intently and was receptive. I think she needs a little time to digest it. As I type this, she is attending her first individual counseling session. Perhaps she will address this "food for thought". My faith will never be the same for I will never forget how He nurtured such sweet fruit from such a poisonous vine. Though we are far from reconciliation (Rhonda has much healing to do and I must still must continue to address the effects of child abuse), things are looking up. Praise God in Heaven... PRAISE GOD for His infinite love for us.

11/10/2008 11:56:25 AM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

PRAISE GOD, PRAISE GOD bless His Holy name, im wish i had the words to tell you how happy this post has made me feel , i am so excited for you both, your pain will help others , it is helping you. They say a seed must die in order to grow, that we must die to self in order to live,after a fire destroys , the regrowth is better than before, He works in mysterous ways, He does work all things together for good.Lord we thank you now for the work Your doing in Dan, we pray You use Him mighti, Bless tihs couplely in Jesus name

11/10/2008 7:00:26 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Your faith is really getting stretched! Romans 8:28 AMEN! Praise the Lord!

11/10/2008 9:42:00 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

"What then shall we say in response to this? If God be for us, who can be against us?

11/12/2008 8:48:10 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Giving thanks I have so much to thank God for... my children, my extended family, our health, the opportunities He has provided to me to counter the economic crisis we are all facing. Included in my "Thanksgiving List" are those who He sent to help me get through the emotional storm of my separation and to guide me on my spiritual journey. You all have my thanks for your unselfish support, kind words, great advice, PATIENCE, and most of all, prayers. May He bless you with peace, joy, health, and prosperity for you are His beacons in the darkness. An update As things currently stand, we are no closer to a reconciliation than we were when we started. While the door hasn't been closed altogether, I see no indication in Rhonda that she will ever come home. We continue to individually go to counseling each week - focusing on our own issues. Recently, Rhonda told me that she had read the messages posted here. She took offense at the "prodigal" label that was used to describe her. She continues to remind me that God accepts divorce in cases of infidelity, and that, while she professes to have forgiven me for my horrible actions those 5 years ago, that they killed her love for me. She said that those who told me to "pray for the restoration of my marriage, and He will make it so" are wrong and have given me flawed spiritual advice. With your help, I finally was able to truly turn this all over to our Heavenly Father. I am at peace as I wait for Him to do His work and am open to whatever outcome He has planned for me. I am steadfast in my belief that the outcome will be the best thing for me and that He will bring me happiness. Based on how much Rhonda will have to change to want to come back and to be whole enough for me to allow her to come back, the restoration of our marriage will be nothing short of a miracle. But miracles are what He does for those with faith. "Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see." Hebrews 11:1 When I turned this over to Him, I stopped praying for marriage restoration and started praying for Him to decide what is best for me. I have no doubt that He will do just that. Happy Thanksgiving!

11/26/2008 3:40:20 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

That's a good thing He knows whats best for you, for you all, Hebrews 11:1 very good, i do look forward to the day i see your post saying where all of this has led you led you all. I want to say SORRY to Rhonda for any thing i have posted that may have up set her, i should remember that there is more than one person in situatoins, i should respect how they may be feeling, i do and will keep praying for all His best for you and your family.

11/26/2008 4:32:17 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

The question I have is: which prevails? ...Matthew 19:9 which states that infidelity justifies divorce, or Malachi 2:15 which states that God hates divorce? I've been struggling with this for some time. The sins of those who truly repent are forgiven as well as forgotten by God. We are forgiven to the level that we forgive. So isn't it imperative for Rhonda to forgive so that she may also receive forgiveness from Him? If she has, as she declares, forgiven me, then is she not breaking God's marriage covenant if she divorces me or refuses to come back home? I see Matthew 9:19 applying to one whose spouse refuses to stop sinning and/or refuses to repent. I have refused to do neither - I have been faithful for years and have truly repented... and she knows it. Opinions on this will be welcomed!

11/26/2008 6:18:47 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

" Divorce is as hurtful and destructive today as in Jesus' day. God intends marriage to be a lifetime committment (Genesis 2:24). When entering into marriage, people should never consider divorce as an option for solving problems or a way out of a relationship that seems dead. In these verses, Jesus is also attacking those who purposely abuse the marriage contract, using divorce to satisfy their lustful desire to marry someone else..." " Jesus said divorce is not permissible except for unfaithfulness. This does not mean that divorce should automatically occur when a spouse commits adultery. The word "unfaithful" implies a sexually immoral lifestyle, not a confessed and repented act of adultery. Those who discover that their partner has been unfaithful should make every effort to forgive, reconcile, and restore their relationship. We are always to look for reasons to restore the marriage relationship rather than for excuses to leave it." From Life Application Bible, copyright 1996. Page 1413 regarding Matthew 5:31-32 Also, "And anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery." Matthew 5:32b Spoken by Jesus

11/26/2008 8:37:10 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

"Recently, Rhonda told me that she had read the messages posted here. She took offense at the "prodigal" label that was used to describe her. She continues to remind me that God accepts divorce in cases of infidelity, and that, while she professes to have forgiven me for my horrible actions those 5 years ago, that they killed her love for me. She said that those who told me to "pray for the restoration of my marriage, and He will make it so" are wrong and have given me flawed spiritual advice." Brother Dan, It is good that Rhonda has read these posts. In response I must post the following: "If you return to the Almighty and clean up your life, you will be restored." Job 22:23 "In His kindness God called you to eternal glory by means of Jesus Christ. After you have suffered a little while, He will restore, support and strengthen you and He will place you on a firm foundation." 1Peter 5:10 "For all the promises of God in Him are "yes" and in Him we say "amen" to the glory of God." 2Corinthians 1:20 "And this is the confidence that we have in Him, if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us. And if we know that He hears us, whatever we ask, we can be sure He will give us what we ask for." 1John 5:14-15 Please ask Rhonda, what part of God's Word is flawed advice? I told you already that I sow seed. The seed is the Word of God Luke 8:11

11/27/2008 10:05:32 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

mrspiggy, Thank you for your reply. I forwarded a copy of it to Rhonda with the following message: Rhonda, In my effort to use this "storm" in my life to grow my faith and understanding in His word, I posted a couple of messages regarding your comments and observations about the "Delve into Jesus" posts. Below is a response directed to you. Before you form an opinion about the message below, it will be helpful for you to read the last five or so posts. You'll see that I'm only trying to understand how God sees our situation. I'm not trying to manipulate you in any manner. Your thoughts on this will mean a lot to me. Thanks, Dan

11/27/2008 10:57:00 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, I perceive from Rhonda's words that restoration is not her will. As we all know, God does not force us to come to Him against our will. However, since we cannot control our circumstances, our will is subject to change with a change in our circumstances. Remember Jonah? He didn't want to do what was God's will either. These words were spoken by Jesus in Matthew 18:19, "I also tell you this: If two of you agree down here on earth concerning anything you ask, My Father in heaven will do it for you." There are at least two people who have posted here that have agreed in asking God to restore your marriage. It will be so. God is not a man that He should lie, nor the son of man that He should repent. If He spoke it, He will make it so. 1Samuel 15:29 Further, Isaiah 55:11 states, "It is the same with my word, I send it out and it always produces fruit. It will accomplish all I want it to, and it will prosper everywhere I send it." As KJV states, His word does not return to Him void. You can send her all the messages you care to. I do not apologize for the word of God. It is not a menu where we choose only the scriptures we like. Jesus said we must not live by bread alone, but by EVERY WORD of God. Matthew 4:4

11/27/2008 11:58:19 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

Thanks for your insight and truth, mrspiggy. If I may add: "And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one.' For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins." Matthew 6:13-15 "Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, "Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother when he sins against me? Up to seven times?" Jesus answered, "I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times." Matthew 18:21-22 "Above all, love each other deeply, because love covers over a multitude of sins." I Peter 4:8 "Then they can train the younger women to love their husbands and children, to be self-controlled and pure, to be busy at home, to be kind, and to be subject to their husbands, so that no one will malign the word of God." Titus 2:4-5 (emphasis mine)

11/28/2008 4:23:27 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

For clarification: This was mis-translated: "And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one.' It should read: "Let us not be led into temptation." As written, one would get the impression that God leads us into temptation. When in reality He does not. Very good scriptures. That "and be subject to their husbans" concerns women answering to their own husbands not anybody else's husband. The emphasis is on the word "their". A lot of women have issues with this scripture because they don't understand that being subject to their husband is a matter of honoring him as God intended. It does not mean she's his slave. There is an order of things. God, husband, wife, children. Remeber God told Adam about the tree. It was Adam's responsibility to make sure Eve didn't eat from the tree. Well, you know the story...

11/28/2008 4:47:59 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

i hope this helps you to understand Rhonda...my husband has a problem he hid very well, till we got a computer for the kids for school, a bill comes over 3000.i took it to the kids was told you need to speak to Dad, ? all hell breaks loose, i believe it's my fault as a wife, but i can't and wont cross that line, then we find God, it's not my fault, i forgive him, i do hate the sin, i don't think i love the man, i have trouble understang wifes submit, so i'm praying for him for us and our children, i believe God has to do more work in me for our marriage, all he has to do is quit repent, i pray that for him, but at this very moment i have no LOVE for this man, God help me, i really want our marriage to work, but there is that but, so be patient with Rhonda, trust God, don't say what you think she should feel and do because you can use scripture at her, let her heal, let her let God heal her give her time, it won't work because you said sorry and want it to normal again, i may be asked to get off this site but , she is where you sent her because BACK THEN NOT NOW you could only see your needs, and sorry is the easist word in the world to say, but what we do says it better, really what we don't do says it clearer, you said she read the posts and was a little upset by some, well, that really made me think , i read your post i feel for you i pray for you ,i bet if Rhonda posted under an onother name , her prayer needs i'd be praying differently about the same situation, i love how you have responded , in prayer, and love for Rhonda, and God will sort it out and use it for good, i do pray your marriage works out for both of and the childern they end up suffering the most. God bless you all

11/28/2008 8:07:29 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Sister Mammak, God bless you. I will not say that I understand what you face with your husband or what Brother Dan is facing with Rhonda. But, I will say that I know what it feels like to "have no love" for a person. God understands too. That is why He created grace. We all live by His grace and He wants us to extend the same grace to those we share our lives with. Use His love and grace toward others. Basically, we are all self-centered. It is the sin we were born into. Jesus came to deliver us from it. He says we don't have to look out for our own self interest anymore. Trust Him to look out for us. Forgiveness is an awesome thing. Love is attached to it. I don't know if we forgive because we love or we love because we forgive. I just know that they are intertwined. For God so loved the world that He forgave us through His Son. And He offers His love to us to use the same way. When we say, "Lord, I can't do this in my own strength. I can't do it without You." He will strengthen you and give you His love to use for others. You are an awesome woman of God. "Wives, submit yourselves to your husbands as you do the Lord. For a husband is the head of his wife as Christ is head of His body, the church; He gave His life to be her Savior." Ephesians 5:22-23. As women, we really don't like the sound of this. But it is written to bless us. We have to obey God's word, whether we like the sound of it or not. Isaiah 1:19 says, "If you are willing and obedient, you will eat the good of the land." Seems to be a good incentive to me. I am convinced that any type of tribulation or trial is to help us grow our faith. We must keep in mind that His name is above every name. We must train ourselves to magnify His name instead of the mountain we are up against. I agree with your post concerning the word "sorry". I try not to use it myself. True godly sorrow will cause a person to repent as you said. The person will turn away from that attitude or behavior. We must also bear in mind that all sin is committed against God. Your husband has hurt you and his children. But, he has sinned against God. As his wife, you are to pray for him. Keep in mind that he is being deceived by the enemy. I will stand in prayer with you that his eyes will be opened to the Truth. That he will submit himself to God. Then, he will be the husband that God has created him to be. And you children will see this and glorify God. I apologize for such a long post, but I had to give all that God has given me to share.

11/29/2008 11:23:30 AM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

To mammak's husband, I do not profess to know your situation or how it may have contributed to your actions which now endanger your relationship with your wife and perhaps even your marriage. I will not assume to know your level of faith in God. But I'll assume you love your wife - even if you don't realize it at this moment. When a wife no longer makes herself accessible to her husband, or if years of "same old, same old" has deteriorated your mutual passion, the easy response is to eventually refocus your passions elsewhere. The hard response is to try to re-foster that which you both had in the past. I want to state a case for the latter. First, the level of our passion for each other is a barometer of the many other aspects of the relationship. If acts of love are replaced by thread-bare tolerance or even intolerance, the marital bond is weakened. If you want passion in your life as well as the many other true blessings of marriage, work on nurturing communication and mutual respect for each other. TALK TO HER!!! Let her know how you feel, what you feel is missing in your relationship, and what she can do to help it get better and stronger. LISTEN TO HER!!! Don't expect that the "good" you seek will come without some changes and sacrifices on your part, too! I strongly encourage you to see the movie "Fireproof" and get the book "The Love Dare" which was the focus of the movie. Take the 40 day challenge outlined by the book. Isn't your marriage and your family worth a 40 day investment? And finally, I want to share with you my own experience... my own outcome. I believe you are lucky enough to still have a chance to save your marriage. I was not so lucky. In the first year of my marriage, I cheated on my wife and treated her with utter disrespect. I spent the next four years trying to make amends because, at that very moment when I thought I might lose her, I realized how much I truly loved her. I went to a counselor, I worked on my problems with all the might I had. While I remained faithful to her thereafter, I still had anger issues that were slow to resolve. The very acts of making amends changed me in her eyes from a strong, confident man to a dependent weakling she could no longer respect. As it's turned out, there was no amount of trying that could save my marriage. My wife left me 44 days and three hours ago. Each hour ever since has been the most painful of my life. The "joy" I experienced when I cheated on her was akin to pennies compared to the billions of dollars worth of love I lost. You are a stranger standing on a street corner, about to step out in front of a bus. I am grabbing for your arm... please step back, sir... before its too late!!! God gave you your wife and His instructions on how to be happy with her in marriage. I read those instructions far too late. Please do not make the same mistakes I made - I implore you... please do not do that. mammak, I hope you will focus on forgiveness. I believe God allows us to be subjected to storms when we need a swift kick in the spiritual pants. I suspect that both you and your husband have fallen short of tending to your marriage... a marriage as defined by His plan. I'm not saying you are responsible for his actions, but perhaps there is more you can do to foster a good, sound marriage. If you both read nothing else, please read Ephesians 5:22-33. I cannot think of anything more painful than a failed marriage. It not only affects the spouses, it affects the children for the rest of their lives. In that light, there is no amount of "trying" that is too much. Pray for His guidance, His strength, His wisdom. Please Heavenly Father, hear my prayer for my sister, mammak, her husband and her family. Please guide them through this storm and help them to see how precious their love and marriage truly is. Place Your hand of love upon their hearts and give them compassion and wisdom. Guide them back to Your path of a holy marriage as You have set forth in Your Word. Let them hear my words and comprehend my pain so that they may avoid the bitterness of the medicine I must continue to take. In Christ's name I pray, Amen.

11/29/2008 2:49:37 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Rhonda called me and told me she read the posts here last night. Regarding the interpretation of Matthew 5:31-32 from the "Life Application Bible", she said (paraphrasing) "that's someone else's' interpretation but it isn't mine". I told her that such interpretations are from a team of biblical scholars but she brushed that off. She also said (again, paraphrasing), "You don't know who 'those people' are on that web site... how do you know they know what they're talking about?" I responded that they are quoting applicable scripture on which their positions are based. Since I, too, can read and think, I can formulate my own opinion on their conclusions. I have concluded that they are correct. I stressed that I'm not interested in hearing what I want to hear, but am seeking truth. To do less is futile. At age 50, the time has come in my life to cast out the deceptions that have made a shambles of my life. I don't want to suffer from the dysfunctions of child abuse any longer. This is my one big chance to purge self destructive behavior from my life and, more importantly, live a life of faith as close to God as my weak, sinful self can achieve. I suggested that she respond with a post of her own but she declined. She is sticking to her position that an act of infidelity (regardless of true, demonstrated repentance on my part) is her get out of jail free card which trumps His instructions on forgiveness. She intends to address this with our Christian counselor on Monday. I pray that God uses this opportunity to help her understand His true position on this. I continued to remind her that I did not want to discuss any of this as we are supposed to be working on our individual issues. She believes I'm trying to use scripture to force her back to me when, in reality, I only want her to make her decision based on the truth of His Word. I emphasized that I really have given this whole thing over to Christ. My first prayer is for Rhonda's healing, my second is for God to keep me on His path - wherever it may lead me. She will not find peace and happiness if her decision is contrary to His Word. I pray that she, as I have, will give this to Him for resolution. Through all of this I am grateful of one thing. In ministries which focus on marriage restoration (such as Rejoice Ministries), there is a lot of emphasis on "forgiving the prodigal spouse". It seems that many who stand for their marriage understandably have ill feelings toward their spouse. I thank God that I have never once felt any anger or hate (frustration, maybe) toward Rhonda. I only feel love for her. At least this is one chasm I don't have to cross.

11/29/2008 4:01:56 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

everything was hidden well till the computer, we were fine, he is on the computer till 2-4 am everynight, thats not my choice thats his, i never said that or me, i said thats not for me, i am praying waiting on God to fix this, i trust His timing i want him to be the head, i'm really tired of being everything in our home, he is a good man well respected, very hard worker, there for us, he's on my side, it's the that...i do tell him i'm proud of ect ect, i want him to know or feel that i do care, it's low selfesteem or child hood hurt, i pray God will reveal the root cause, but in all things you do have to want to change or in this case give up, i can only submit to whats right, the computer was taken out of the up stais room put in the pool room big glass doors, i even got the filter then i realised , if i truely trust God there is no need for me to do more than pray, he's not a child, thank you for your imput it's great i don't talk about it as i don't want to give it more life, i just felt for Rhonda, my heart and prayers ae for all the troubled marriages, you said this your self the kids get torn apart. God bless you Mrspiggy, i value your thuoghts

11/29/2008 9:29:30 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

That was so nice of you i will try to get him to read it, funny you know , i can't get him to talk, he says there is nothing wrong don't worry, it's only a sexual game, i have nothing to worry about ? yes storms can be for a swift kick BUT not for my very young children 2 of them girls, who now say they may marry, BUT will adpot,no sex, yes there is a lot more i can do BUT i won't, i don't think God want's me or any wife , all of this came from how i suddenly felt for Rhonda, i know how she feels. i think i do at least,we have been together since 1983, married in 1986, i have stood by i haven't argued over this as i thought it was my fault, we found God and i realise it's not me, i'm still standing by him, the kids love him as a dad, they need him as a dad, they get hurt he says they over react or are silly i do everything i can to make our home happy safe and loving for us all, while he lives on the computer, i haven't changed much since the day we got married even i can see that, so it's none that, it is simply his hobby, he comes to bed between 2-4am everynight, after dinner he sleeps in front of the telly, you tell me what i should do more of, my eldest daughter held this against me for awhile years ago because she thought i didn't do anything about it, then she wanted me to leave so i could have a life her words not mine, then she learnt to love the man hate the sin, i don't judge him, i'm waiting on God to set him free, i read this it goes something like this, stay where you were when you were planted of found God, this is where i was and this is where i'll stay, in prayer and faith, with and beside my husband , i just don't think i'm in love, but He is able.i didn't mean to get this going i don't talk about it , i don't want to keep on giving it life, and i don't want it to be all i think about , it was for a while, thank you for your care and prayer, we are blessed.

11/30/2008 12:51:00 AM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

mammak, I don't think it is wise to close your eyes to satan's presence in your house. Look at what it is doing to you, your children, your husband, your family. Your complicity is sending a signal to your husband that, while you don't like it, you're allowing it. I'm not suggesting that you act to create strife and conflict, but I think you need to stand up for your marriage and His plan for marriage. The longer you let this go on, the more distance will be created between you and your husband until there is no marriage left. To mammak's husband, "There's nothing wrong, don't worry, its just a sex game." Let's see... you've racked up a 3,000 (dollar? pound?) porn site bill in one month, your daughters now see physical intimacy between husband and wife as dirty and appalling, and your wife's heart is broken. No... nothing to worry about there! Can you spell D E N I A L ??? Let me point out what else you are in denial on - that your wife will put up with this forever and that, even if she leaves you, it won't matter to you. You have no idea how lucky you are that your wife is still standing for your marriage even though you flaunt this in her face. You have no idea how much I wish I could turn the clock back and avoid the same mistakes you are making right now. I implore you to open your eyes and think about what it will be like to feel like a piece of your soul has been ripped from you... going for days without any real sleep... crying like a baby because of the pain you feel until you are throwing up... feeling completely helpless because you cannot erase your past actions which you will ultimately deplore... hating yourself for the pain you caused for the person who loved you more than anyone on earth. Open your eyes, sir... before it's too late. Ignoring God, are you? I did. I was just like you. I trivialized my actions and pompously thought I'd "get away with it". My denial of God did not stop Him from intervening. He pulled the rug out from under me and let my butt hit the floor hard enough to change my life forever. If you don't change your course NOW, you'll find yourself in the same position I'm in. You'll find yourself in such a hopeless situation that, despite your desire to "have her back with you", you'll desire even more that the pain you caused her will be eradicated - even if that means having to lose her forever. Oh how lucky you are!!! You still have the opportunity to choose the easy path over the hard one. Ponder this... I'd give up everything I own - my business, my house, my car, every dollar I have, my right arm, my sight, my hearing... EVERYTHING!!! if I could change the past and have a second chance at a Godly marriage with my wife. Ignore my warning at your own risk. Perhaps God needs another man to testify about the wrath that will befall those who blindly trade their marriages for shallow, momentary sexual gratification. If that is to be the case, feel free to contact me after you've lost everything dear to you. Misery loves company. Lord Jesus I pray that my testimony will reach the heart of mammak's husband so he may no longer be blinded by the evil that seeks to destroy his marriage, his wife, and his children. Open his eyes so he may repent and seek Your forgiveness and that of his family. I ask that you shield mammak and her children from the detriments of his sinful actions. Dear Lord I implore you to create some good from the horrors I've caused. In the name of Jesus Christ I pray, Amen.

11/30/2008 12:19:40 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

What if Rhonda is right? Perhaps I just lack patience while I await God's plan for me and my marriage to be revealed. Perhaps Rhonda's negative position is taking its toll on my faith that His hatred of divorce negates His acceptance of divorce due to infidelity despite my repentance and years of attempts to make amends. If she is correct in this, then I'm prolonging her pain as well as my own. More importantly, perhaps my "hanging on" is adding more pain on top of that which I already caused. If she is correct, then my "standing" for the restoration of my marriage is in opposition to His will. Perhaps I should put all of this out of my mind while I wait for Him do His work. I have been focusing on my own healing and continue to make progress. But I just don't want to misread the direction He wants me to go. Taking past advice, I seek answers in His Word. I spent hours last night reading from the Bible... seeking His direction. I've re-read the entire string of posts here - paying particular attention to the scripture you've all referenced for me. But a clear answer from Him has not come. I am weary. As time goes by, I feel more and more like giving up... succumbing to Rhonda's desire to move on. Be merciful to me, Lord, for I am faint; O Lord, heal me, for my bones are in agony. My soul is in anguish. How long, O Lord, how long? Psalm 6:2-3

11/30/2008 1:54:49 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, I do not have a scripture for you right now. This is my personal opinion. I think you should back off and spend alone time with God. Instead of reading the Word, spend time meditating on the scriptures. Ask God to reveal to you what His word means for your situation. Give Him time to speak directly to you. I promise you He will. It may take a while, but He is faithful. When He speaks to you, nobody else's opinion will matter. You will need to be sincere, patient and quiet so that you can hear Him. And as Mary said to the servants, whatever He tells you to do, do it.

11/30/2008 2:53:37 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

mrspiggy, I will take your advice. Thanks!

11/30/2008 3:36:33 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

i went to Africa 4 years ago on a mission trip God gave me a vision of him in the future, and a word for him, i am staying true to that, you must not forget our children LOVE him, hate what he does, why should i leave drag the kids around ext add to it , it should have been him , i have in the past demanded he leave, the ususl sorry ext give me a chanch to fix this, he does try, it's stronger than him, BUT God is stronger than all of us, and He is willing i'm not shutting my eyes, i love my children too much for that, it stopped being about me years ago, for me it's about them, i will not let satan have his way, or take the easy way out, you say i allow it, if you had any idea how this has been for me alone let alone us, how hard it is to stand for this marriage you would never say that, if he was on drugs you would have said get him some help, my children protected me , i didn't allow anything, the damage was done, they still protect me. he meets with our doctor now who is a Christian, he and his wife have a marriage ministry, i decided the only way was THROUGH this, as my daughter says 'Mom Dad is going to love us so much more, when he understands' I don't cry anymore i pray and trust. i spend my time seeking God more, not reliving it as i used to, and i'm happy, i can't change yesterday, but i can have a God blessed today, you have a God blessed day, thank you for caring.

11/30/2008 3:38:28 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

you say i allow it, if you had any idea how this has been for me alone let alone us, how hard it is to stand for this marriage you would never say that, mammak, your last post revealed more than was initially revealed. Now I see you are doing everything you can. Forgive me for jumping to a false conclusion. I wish Rhonda was even 10 percent as committed to our marriage as you are to yours. I pray that God opens your husband's eyes to the damage his actions are causing.

11/30/2008 3:45:49 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

No need to be sorry, i shouldn't have posted anything, i just felt for Rhonda, when you put something out there you have to be ready to hear what others think, some times thats really good, some times it should be God only this is one i think, i loved the way you wanted to reach out to Kevin, I will show him but not now. Please pray for the day you read from me ... IT IS DONE...our best is His will, it just may not be what we think, How about we keep standing in in prayer, for His best in all our lives.

11/30/2008 3:58:54 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Matthew 6:6 reads: "But when you pray, go away by yourself, shut the door behind you and pray to your Father secretly. Then your Father who knows all secrets will reward you." I believe this is what Sister Mammak has been doing. And He will reward her openly. Everyone will see the fruit of her secret prayers. God is so faithful. I just love that about Him.

11/30/2008 6:35:25 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

first seek the kingdom of heaven and everythang else shall follow brother god has rhonda not rhonda and when we try to put our hands on what god has planned it;s a no go me i trust in the lord what ever you asketh for remember god knows your heart and he knows whats best god bless be strong trust in him ; jody

12/3/2008 12:37:50 AM by jodieblunt, Member of Delve into Jesus since 12/2/2008

God's will is never divorce. Yes in Mathew is says that divorce is acceptable under circumstances of infidelity, but don't you remember what Paul says in 1 corins 10:23, "All things are lawful," but not all things are helpful. "All things are lawful," but not all things build up" So yeah, divorce may be justifiable, but its not a part of God's plan or will, and it certain is not beneficial. Let no one separate what God has joined together. I have seen God restore my parents marriage, and it was truly ONLY by the GRACE of the Lord Almighty. Yes, God accepts divorce in cases like infidelity, but its not His will. He would rather see a plan of redemption and reconcilation. God is a God of redemption and resoration, that has always been His plan, so take heart and don't be discouraged. Trust in Him! I've seen indescribable joy in the lives of women who has chosen the the road of redemption and restoration in their marriages, instead of the destruction of divorce, although it was justifiable. I just wish Rhonda only knew of the amazing things the Lord had for her if she would walk in His plan, and His plan is always a plan of restoration, because He would never have a plan to destroy.

12/8/2008 4:36:26 AM by blackbox, Member of Delve into Jesus since 6/5/2008

I for one loved what you have said, i choose to wait on His plan for my marriage, a real faith for my husband then His plan will work, i don't plan to get in His way. God bless you

12/8/2008 3:44:28 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

Thanks, blackbox, for your insight and observations. As I've told our counselor and Rhonda, my first prayer is for her to heal and find God's way, then I pray for the restoration of my marriage. While my love for her puts her well being ahead of my own desires, I cannot ignore, as you put it, "the amazing things the Lord had for her if she would walk in His plan, and His plan is always a plan of restoration". Sadly, she continues to pull farther from restoration. Over the weekend, she told me she "can't stand me" and then went on to talk about the parameters of divorce. Of course these words cut like a saber, but I did not respond much except to say "I've put this in His hands." It's so hard to see someone you love so much take the wrong path. But I await His work. Perhaps the storm He sees necessary for Rhonda to endure consists of far more than our marital issues. I cannot ignore that the free will He has given her may allow her to lose her way completely. I pray each day that He will intervene in her life and lead her on His path. One thing is for certain... I'll never question if my feelings for her are true love or merely need. Despite all the conflicts, all the harsh words, all the rejection, I feel nothing but love for her. If you knew me, you'd know that that is very much out of my normal character. However, perhaps He has used this storm to change me for the better.... His silver lining to this dark cloud.

12/8/2008 4:12:04 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

It's all over but the paperwork For some reason, God has chosen not to give me and my son a Christmas miracle... or any miracle, for that matter. Our counselor has concurred that, by now (over two months of separation), there should have been some progress made in Rhonda's heart. He agreed with me that there is a high likelihood that there has been someone else in the picture for quite some time. Regardless of whether or not that is the case, she has continued to push more distance between us. On the advice of our counselor, I created a "paradoxical event" - I told Rhonda that the door to reconciliation was soon going to close... that if she had even a shred of desire to reconcile, she'd have to demonstrate such by even the smallest proactive gesture. On Monday, I went to my weekly counseling appointment. Immediately thereafter, I attended a "Divorce Recovery" program at Willow Creek Community Church. In a last "put salt on the wounds" gesture, Rhonda accused me of "having a hot date". She told me I was lying about attending because the Church's website stated that the last meeting was two weeks ago. Eventually she found out that the meeting I attended was an "informal" meeting to provide some pre-Christmas support to those in need. She never apologized to me. Yesterday Rhonda went to what she now had determined to be her last counseling appointment. She told me she she considers the door already closed to reconciliation and that the only thing left to do is to proceed with the divorce. So that's it, I guess. Despite all of our collective prayers, my marriage is over. To attempt to describe the depth of despair I feel would be futile. Were it not for my belief in God and my responsibility to my children, the course I'd choose would be permanent and finite. The evil one has attempted to destroy my faith with these events but he will not succeed. I committed to walk God's path for me no matter how long, hard, painful and hopeless it may be. I will not question it, I will not ask why it has to be so painful. Perhaps unyielding faith will be rewarded, perhaps it will not... but I will not break my promise. However I do not have the strength to continue to "stand" for my marriage. Through Rejoice Ministries, I see that some stand for years after divorce. I truly respect them for their strength... strength I do not have. The last few months have taken their toll on me. I just cannot continue. I believe God's lack of intervention is His way of telling me that reconciliation is just not going to happen. As I proceed through Divorce Recovery, I will post updates here on how things go. Perhaps it will add to the message for others that a Godly marriage is worth protecting because the cost of losing it is exponentially beyond belief. To make it through Christmas, I'm going to try to focus on the miracle and blessing of Christ's birth. But I must be honest and state that this will be the hardest and least enjoyable Christmas I'll ever experience. Your prayers for me to make it through this will be very appreciated, to say the least. I'm also going to continue to pray for Rhonda's healing, well being, and happiness. I have no animosity toward her... only undying love. As I said when I started this thread, "Husbands, please do not make the same mistakes I made". It bears repeating. I wish you all a very blessed Christmas.

12/24/2008 1:21:26 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

I don't believe it. "Over two months" means what? Does the words "suddenly" or "immediately" appear in your Bible?

12/24/2008 3:29:59 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

NOOOOOOO!!!!.... don't give up you are looking at the natutal remember Proverbs 3:5=6, read Acts, God is a rewarder, His word is true, build your faith up, you must let go, no matter what trust God, your wife is hurt, let her get to where she needs to be not where you want her to be, i know that much, i don't push my husband NOW it's been over 20 years i can now see changes he is picking up the Bible less computer, if i had of pushed i and my children would have missed what God has in store through this, what are you going to loose by waiting trusting, see what you will gain by faith in time His time, what if Jesus gave up in that garden, He didn;t have the strength but when he said Your will not Mine, He was strengthened.Praise God or that, we gained. It's Christmas morning here i want to wisy you a merry christmas, we are all blessed because of this day.

12/24/2008 4:49:27 PM by mammak, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/3/2008

mrspiggy & mammak, My sincere thanks for your perspective and insight. My prayers for Rhonda's healing and a reconciliation of my marriage have been steadfast. But I've also prayed for Him to guide me to the destination He has determined for me. In answer to the latter, He has shown me some things "on the other side of the mountain". In particular is Rhonda's cold, hardened heart. When she was attending counseling, I kept the door open to the potential for her heart to warm and soften. Counseling was the only positive thing she was doing that kept a glimmer of hope for reconciliation. Now that she has ended that, she is void of effort. In fact, her participation in counseling was empty... she made no positive effort at all. I believe she attended only to "go through the motions" so that she could tell herself and our son that "she tried". I believe in the deepest part of my heart that she will never come back to me. Yes, God could make that happen if He chose to do so but there has been no indication that this is his plan. Quite the contrary, every thing that has happened makes me believe that this is one marriage He does not intend to save. Not every troubled marriage prayed over by His faithful is reconciled. Sadly, mine appears to be one of them. While my faith remains strong, I am not one to question His wisdom. We all know that bad things happen to good people... bad things that are irreversible. Take, for instance, the tragic accident some years ago that took the lives of all the children of a pastor and his wife (auto accident in Wisconsin). All the prayers in the world will not bring back their children as it is not His will. And so it appears to be for my marriage. As I stated in my previous post, I know there are those who stand for their prodigal spouses years after divorce. But I am just not strong enough to do so. For several years I have tried so hard to win her heart back but to no avail. This has taken its toll on me and my health. I now get headaches so bad that I lose my vision in my left eye and get nosebleeds that are almost unstoppable. My hair is falling out and my stomach is always on fire. Yet He has not given me a sign that I should continue my stand. I have sought answers and direction in scripture. Isaiah 30:20-21 "Although the Lord gives you the bread of adversity and the water of affliction, your teachers will be hidden no more; with your own eyes you will see them. Whether you turn to the right or to the left, your ears will hear a voice behind you, saying, 'This is the way, walk in it.'" "Let her go" seems to be the way He intends for me. Another reason I think it is time for me to end my stand is the effects it has on my son. The stronger I stand, the more Rhonda resists and the more strife is created between us. Moving out has been hard enough on him. It would be irresponsible of me to make things harder.

12/24/2008 8:56:23 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, I don't know where God is leading you. But I do know the safest place in the world is in His will. Be blessed and know that we are praying for you and your family. Take care of your temple.

12/24/2008 11:09:54 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

mrspiggy, As late as today I gave Rhonda one last chance to make even a token gesture toward "fixing things" between us. She refused... she is firm in her commitment to move on. I've agonized over my decision to stop standing for my marriage. If I thought He wanted me to continue, I'd be happy to walk through the fires of Hell for decades. But He has given me no indication that I should continue to do so. I'll admit to being concerned that I'm making a mistake... that perhaps I'm wrong in my assumption of what His path is for me. But I know I've prayed faithfully for guidance and do not think He would not deny me that. The hardest part is accepting that His path for me excludes reconciliation as it seems somewhat contrary to His Word. However I do not think it wise to place my interpretations of His Word above His responses to my requests for guidance. I sincerely desire to be obedient to His will. I guess I won't know if I "got it right" until my day of judgment, or at such time that He makes it more clear to me. But I do know that continuing my stand is destroying me... I'm at the end of my strength to keep going. He wants His faithful to have happiness and good things. I am heeding His instructions to not sow seeds on stone. mrspiggy, your insight and opinion is most valuable to me. Please let me know what you think.

12/29/2008 12:17:10 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Brother Dan, God's Word IS His guidance. I don't think your interpretation is any different than anybody else's. We have all read the words, "I hate divorce." It means the same to all of us. He is not a god of confusion. Paul wrote: When you've done all to stand. Stand. It is really not about you. It's about God and whether or not you trust His word. The most significant scripture I have ever read and that has caused me to have absolute faith is Isaiah 55:11. "It is the same with my word. I send it out, and it always produces fruit. It will accomplish all I want it to, and it will prosper everywhere I send it." I like your statement: "I'm at the end of my strength to keep going." That's good. Now, you can lean on His strength. He never ask us to do anything that can't be done. He supplies everything we need to do what He calls us to do. That's why 2Corinthians 12:9 was penned. I trust the character of God. He watches over His word to perform it. That's enough to keep me standing until Jesus returns. I am standing for your marriage. The question is, "Will you stand with me?"

12/29/2008 12:43:32 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

"Jesus wept." I went before the Lord concerning your marriage and this was the result. I went to my Bible and found this scripture. John 11:35. This was concerning the death of Lazarus. Let's start at verse 34: " Where have you put him?" He asked them. They told him, "Lord, come and see." Then Jesus wept. The people standing nearby said, "See how much He loved him." But some said, "This man healed a blind man. Why couldn't He keep Lazarus from dying?" We all know that Jesus decided not to go heal Lazarus. As a matter of fact, He delayed His return so that Lazarus would die. But the answer to my inquiry is verse 40: 'Jesus responded, "Didn't I tell you that you will see God's glory if you believe?" Brother Dan, Please know that just because you gave Rhonda a last chance to change her mind, God is not through with your marriage. Just believe. I know you're tired, but believe anyway. You don't have to talk to her or post updates or see the counselor, just believe. Jesus wept. Not because Lazarus was dead, but because they didn't believe.

12/29/2008 2:04:47 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

I guess when Rhonda informed me that she is no longer going to go to counseling and when the "paradoxical event" I implemented based on our counselor's advice didn't shake Rhonda from her course, I saw these as His signs that this is finished. Truly, ever since Rhonda informed me that she was leaving, there has not been one positive event or action on her part. Considering all my prayers for His guidance, I believe moving on is His path for me. I cannot imagine He would ignore my pleas for guidance and let me make the wrong choice. Regarding your reference to Isaiah 55:11, and in particular, "It will accomplish all I want it to..." I have no doubt that this is true. The question is, "What does he want it to do?" Yes, He hates divorce but He did provide for divorce in circumstances involving infidelity. I was not faithful all those years ago. So therein lies the quandary... what IS His will? I don't think God wants me to suffer needlessly. If it is His will that my marriage ends, then who am I to continue to stand... especially if it is for naught and if it destroys my children's father? I know it looks like I'm rationalizing this to support my decision. But I truly want to do what He wants me to do.

12/29/2008 2:10:08 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

mrspiggy, Regarding your reference to the story of Lazarus, it's not really a question of my belief that God's will will be done, it is a question of what His will is. I know there is no challenge too great for Him. He could change Rhonda's heart as well as her mind if He chose to do so. As much as I desire it to be so, I just don't see that as His will. That is why I decided to go to the Divorce Recovery program... in search of the answer to the big question, "Does God sometimes choose not to reconcile a marriage?" If so, what am I supposed to do? How am I supposed to proceed? What is His path for me? Beyond the issue of my marriage is my true desire to do as God wants me to do.

12/29/2008 2:43:11 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

First, let's make up our minds on whether God can be trusted to keep His word. He said if you confess your sins to Him, He is just to forgive you and cleanse you from all unrighteousness. He also said He would remove your sin from His memory. As far as the east is from the west. He ONLY forgets our sins, not His word. Thus, this little affliction has nothing to do with your indiscretion as for as God is concerned. You are forgiven. Now, let's take a look at the divorce situation. Moses gave the stiff-necked men this way out NOT God. In chronological order, Moses gave the divorce letter to appease the people in Deuteromomy. God said I hate divorce in Malachi. Jesus never said, My Father says it's okay to divorce for any reason. He, too, refered to it as Moses' Law. Jesus told us plainly that He came to fulfill the law. He took Moses' Law to the cross. God forgives murder. Don't you think He forgives unfaithfulness? We are to forgive it too. No, God does not want you to suffer needlessly. That is why He gave us mustard seed faith and His word that He is working all things out for those who love Him. Whatever decision you have made, is fine. You don't have to rationalize it. If you BELIEVE that what you are doing (standing or not) is the right thing for you, DO IT with all your might. The Word of God says He will back up whatever you say.

12/29/2008 3:19:43 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

I think only He knows what is right for me... not me. I don't want to be single again. I really just want my wife back. For now, I'm going to proceed with moving on. If this course is contrary to His will, then I'm sure He will show me. I cannot tell you how much I desire to follow His path for me. I wish my decision was more affirmative in my mind as being His will. If I sound confused, it's because I am. I continue to seek His word by focusing on the bible. One thing is for certain, God is there with me. He isn't done with me on this. If I am stumbling from His path, I'm sure He will put me back on it for I, without reservation, pray for this every day. If I am doing the correct thing in His eyes, then I await the wonderful things to come.

12/29/2008 3:40:08 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Hi Dan, I came across something and thought of you. Here is just a little portion. Please check out the whole article, I know it is quite long, but I think it will really bless you. When you get to the site, read the first paragraph, then you must Scroll Down a bit to read the rest! God bless you Brother! Keeping you lifted in prayer. (Ignited-Faith) ------------------------ Trials and Tribulations - The Testing of Your Faith "...Though God is totally sovereign in the ways that He works and operates on this earth, and though He can sovereignly choose to protect us from time to time from some of the bad and evil things that can come our way - we have to realize that God cannot stop every single little bad thing that could possibly come our way. If He did, this would then fully remove every single Christian from the Adamic curse, and as long as we are living in this fallen and cursed world, this can never totally happen. As a result, every single person, including every single Christian, will have to face a certain amount of adversity and conflict in this life. So the next time you see something bad happen to you, a loved one or someone else, realize that God is not causing most of these bad events to occur. These bad events are all occurring because of the Adamic curse that is still in full operation on this earth, not because our God is a mean or vindictive God. This will now lead us to a very interesting dilemma as far as the fully surrendered and fully committed Christian is concerned. Per another article we have in our site titled "The Full Surrender," you can classify and group Christians into one of two main camps. In the one camp is the fully surrendered and fully committed Christian. This Christian is walking, living and operating in a full surrender with the Lord. This type of Christian is walking and operating in God's perfect will for their life. They are being fully led by the Lord on their journey through this life, and they are all completing the divine calls, missions and assignments that the Lord has in store for them to complete in this life. Then you have the other kind of Christian who is not operating in this full surrender with the Lord. They are out running their own lives and they are making all of their own decisions as to what goals and aspirations they should be striving for in this life. As a result of running their own lives, these Christians never complete what divine calls and assignments God would've had in store for them in this life had they turned the reigns of their life over to Him. Now here is where a major dilemma can occur with the fully surrendered Christian. The fully surrendered Christian has major advantages over the Christian who has not fully surrendered themselves and their entire lives over to the Lord. The fully surrendered Christian will be getting more divine protection and more divine guidance from the Lord. They will be producing more good fruit for the Lord with some of the works they will end up accomplishing, and as a result, some of them will end up getting the bigger and better blessings from the Lord either in this life or the next life to come But here is what can get the fully surrendered Christian in trouble with the Lord if they do not know how to deal with any type of adversity that may come their way. Everything is going great and good in their walk with the Lord. God is perfectly leading them from glory to glory, from strength to strength, from new adventure to new adventure and from promotion to promotion. But then it happens - some kind of adversity strikes. They have just caught their godly spouse having an affair behind their back, or their young son has just been diagnosed with a terminal illness, or they themselves may have been hit with some kind of major illness or some kind of impending financial disaster. As a result of the severity of the storm cloud that has now just come their way, all of a sudden their high levels of faith in the Lord will take a major nose dive. Here they are, serving God with full intensity and full loyalty, and then all of a sudden God allows a thunderous torpedo shot to come ripping into their lives, shaking the very cores of their walks and existence with Him. They start questioning and wrestling with God as to how and why He could allow something this severe to come ripping through their lives. Where was their divine protection? Why didn't God run interference and keep this bad thing from happening in their life? If God is supposed to have your backside covered as you are walking in this full surrender with Him - then why would He allow any type of severe adversity to ever come your way in the first place? This will now lead us into the next two sections. These next two sections will give us the two additional specific reasons as to why God will allow adversity, and sometimes quite severe adversity, to come our way from time to time as we journey through this earthly life...." http://www.bible-knowledge.com/trials-tribulations.html

12/29/2008 9:56:01 PM by Ignited~Faith, Member of Delve into Jesus since 2/20/2008

IgnitedFaith, Thanks for the article. It solidified some of the things I've been thinking about for the past three months. I guess the only one of the three reasons that still confuses me a bit is the Adamic Curse. I wrestle with the fairness of cursing future generations because of the actions of one. After all, it was God who laid the curse upon us in response to Adam and Eve's disobedience. He is a fair and just God but that doesn't seem fair to the generations who follow. I reflect on my own experiences... the curse of child abuse. I have not allowed the curse that was laid upon me to be handed down to my children, although the effects they will suffer as a result of my pending divorce are apparent. Nevertheless, I did not beat my wife and children the way my father beat me. I did not emotionally abuse my children. The emotional abuse my wife suffered was stopped when I realized that I was transferring the curse. Had I not attempted to stop the transference of that curse, I would have been considered to be evil, selfish, and weak. So therein lies my quandary about the Adamic Curse. The other two reasons (our sanctification in the Lord and the testing of our faith) makes perfect sense to me. I embrace them as gifts from God - albeit painful gifts. No pain - no gain, as they say. I deduced these two reasons in answer to my question of why God would let me at age 5 be sexually abused and why I suffered physical and emotional abuse through most of my childhood. Yes, the suffering and anguish that ensued do not seem fair, but I will not question the path He has set for me. This is why I stopped praying for the restoration of my marriage. Instead, I pray that He will guide me - whether to restoration or to life beyond the pain of divorce. He knows my heart... He knows I want my wife's love back - more than any other earthly thing. By focusing my prayers for His guidance, I offer my obedience. Perhaps He will see this as justification for the miracle return of my wife to me. But I must accept that this may not be His plan... as it appears to be since Rhonda demands that we proceed with the divorce. Again, not one positive sign has been provided to indicate that any other outcome will be forthcoming. My "checklist" also includes my forgiveness of my wife. That's been an easy one. I only feel deep love for her... no animosity or anger... just love. I'm sad for her that she has chosen to throw that love away. But there is nothing I can do about that (God knows I've tried). I thank our Heavenly Father for all the blessings He has bestowed upon me and my family. I thank Him for His grace and His forgiveness. Never did I think that He abandoned me during this life storm. I believe He is tempering the sword of my soul. For that I am thankful, despite the associated pain. And I remain faithful that He will deliver me from this dark valley. Whether that deliverance consists of my wife's return or eventually providing me with a true soul mate, it is deliverance, nonetheless. So I have assumed that moving on and healing from this is His intended path. May He hit me over the head if I'm wrong.

12/30/2008 2:44:01 PM by DanD, Member of Delve into Jesus since 9/25/2008

Dan, I hope you don't mind if I weight in on one thing you wrote about Adam's curse. (In replying to this, please don't think I have not been paying attention to what has been going on with your marriage, it's just that the members of the site have been doing such a wonderful job of offering compassion and wisdom that I have not had much to add, even though I have been following your situation closely and praying very much.) I hope this helps: I also struggled for a long time with the "fairness" of original sin. How can it be fair to impute the sin of one man to an entire people? What did ever do, except be born, that I should be made to pay for this sin? But then I was reminded of the unfairness of Jesus' sacrifice being made available to everyone. It really is "unfair" that I should gain from His death. What did I ever do to deserve His mercy? Those two "unfairness"es really do balance out. As we are condemned, perhaps unfairly, through one man, so too are we saved, quite unfairly, through another. Please know I am praying for you, as are the rest of us at Delve Ministries.

12/30/2008 3:08:18 PM by Michael Lane, Executive Director, Delve Christian Ministries

Brother Dan, I feel like "diggin up bones". So, how are things with you and your wife? I have been in prayer all these months and would like to know if there is any change. Peace be unto you and yours.

5/15/2009 10:13:12 PM by mrspiggy, Member of Delve into Jesus since 1/18/2008

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